Josh Duggar resigns from Family Research Council after sexual abuse allegations

http://www.theblaze.com/contributions/the-duggars-arent-hypocrites-prog…

[Joeb]

Dgeszweda you are absolutely right. No question but a lot of the audience in this forum don’t care what studies say. They believe the studies are ungodly and that the perps so called spiritual restoration is more important than the victims and Justice for the victim as. They only care about the bitterness of the victims and their sin . The only people that got it right was Schapps church. There must be some good water in the fountain at that Baptist church.

……and maybe at some point we ought to confront ourselves and ask what we might be doing that would make this more likely. To draw from this case, here are some things I note:

1. Gothard easy-forgivism. Need to figure out how to have a robust theology of repentance and forgiveness that will hold peoples’ feet to the fire.

2. The Duggar family has a history of “home church” and some fairly radical isolation from the world. OK, the young gentleman was 14 and and may have rarely seen a girl except for his mother and younger sisters…..might have led to some trouble. (noteworthy; I don’t believe Bill Gothard was an active participant at church, either)

3. I’ve read a book by Jim Bob, and it strikes me that he almost consciously lived close to the edge. The trouble with that is that sometimes you fall off. I wonder if this is part of why they went on reality TV…..people got tired of living so close to the edge?

4. 19 kids in 17 pregnancies in only 22 years. From conception to conception, that’s less than 16 months on average…..with six kids, I’m all for “be fruitful and multiply”, but there is a point where you listen to people and give your poor wife’s body time to recover! (and yes, this probably did negatively impact Josh when he needed his mom and dad most)

I will grant that we see this kind of thing all over, so I’m not going to just pile on to them, Bill Gothard, or whoever—it’s part of our sin nature, and there but for the Grace of God go I. But that said, I do think we really ought to use this as an opportunity to examine ourselves and our churches in order to reduce the chance of this happening again.

The problem with Mike Huckabee’s view is that he classifies the impact of sin all the same. While God expects us to forgive those who have sinned against us, there are also consequences, sometimes long term consequences that come with that sin. We have plenty of areas in Scripture where sin has a consequence. Sometimes it is spiritual and sometimes it is societal. Achan sinned, hid it from those in society (obviously never hid it from God), the impact was great, and the result was not only Achan’s death but the death of his family. David asked for forgiveness, it was granted to him but he still lost his son. Moses asked for forgiveness, probably had the closest relationship to God that a man could have, yet lost his chance to enter the promise land.

This was not a lie that a minor told his teacher about the toy he took from a friend. This was a devastating sin that was perpetuated onto a younger child who had no control. The focus (as we often see in Christian circles) is the protection of the perp and not the victim. These victims had to endure the next 4-8 years living with their abuser. There was coverup, the lack of integrity and many other factors here. Besides killing someone, there is probably not another sin someone could commit that is so devastating as the sexual abuse of a minor.

The anger is not that the Duggars are capable of sin. The anger is not that we should ask for forgiveness. The anger is the laisseize-faire in which the sin was treated. The parents had a responsibility and they destroyed that responsibility with the fear they had on the impacts to themselves and their family. To me, I question their integrity, if they feel that their 14 year old could wipe away what was done, by asking forgiveness of other children, some significantly younger than themselves (maybe even 5). And did they really ask forgiveness from the other family? I don’t know, but if someone did this to one of my young children, I am not quite sure what I would have been capable of. There is a reason why, that even in the lowest parts of our society, prison. That amongst all the murders, rapist, thieves and liars that a child molester is repulsive to them.

[F] orgiveness is not a one-time easy decision, particularly if it’s demanded or expected right away for the sake of peace and putting something shameful behind you.

(from the WP article Jim linked above).

The thing that concerns me here is the everyone (not just here at SI, but out in the blogosphere in general) is operating on very little information. All we really know is that 13 years ago, a young teenage boy groped and inappropriately touched 5 girls, including several sisters. He confessed it, and the family dealt with it. Apparently someone wrote a personal letter (for personal catharsis??) and stuffed it in a book that was 3 years later given to some one outside the family. When this kind soul found the letter they promptly called Oprah Winfrey… Winfrey’s people called the Arkansas police and they investigated. Finding nothing new and the old charges out of statute of limitations, the whole thing was done.

That is all we know.

From there, people are calling Josh Duggar a pervert, a pedophile, a molester, etc… The problem is we don’t know enough to judge this situation. Was it an act of a desperate boy, or the action of a young molester? We don’t know. Given that no new reports are out, it seems like a young Josh did some bad things and turned things around. It seems his sisters have forgiven him. We don’t know if anyone else (girls that is… or boys) is involved and what they think.

A few things I am concerned about:

1- Many (not just at SI but out “there”), are acting like every instance of a boy unwantedly touching a girl’s private parts should lead to arrest, marking as a molester, isolation in a youth detention center, and significant psychological counseling. If you haven’t read what is being posted on many news sites about this, it is scary and over the top. I’m not sure about that. There is molestation, no doubt about it. There is also confusion and attention-seeking.

2- If your 12 year old daughter said her 14 year old brother touched her vagina, would you call the police? Hard to think about I know…

3- I have worked with kids at our Youth Detention Center, and they are rough! My son knows nothing about the lives these kids have lived. Jim Bob said he didn’t want Josh exposed to these kids, and I can appreciate that as a first response.

4- Anyone else find it interesting that the crowd asking for Josh to be drawn and quartered are the same people who thought that the Baltimore riots and looting were justified?

5- The complication is the Duggar’s put themselves in this spotlight with the show…

You are the pastor of a church. A 12 year old girl says a 13 year old boy touched her breasts in Sunday School in an intimate way. Do you call the police?

The media in this story says unequivocally yes. What do you think? Is there latitude here?

If you would call, we need to be teaching our boys early to not touch girls (and why), so that your little Jimmy doesn’t wind up in the Youth Detention Center with a criminal record as a sex offender at 13!

Then we need to completely change the way that we teach boys. Because a curiosity could reap horrible consequences.

Then we need to completely change the way that we teach boys. Because a curiosity could reap horrible consequences.

Mark, your comments are so disturbing. To indicate that you aren’t teaching boys this already is problematic. Duggar’s behavior was criminal in nature. If you heard this story as a pastor and were a mandatory reporter, you could be in a heap of trouble legally if you failed to report. Even if you by law were not a mandatory reporter, there have been cases where adults were sued for not reporting. This is not for YOU to decide. This is for experts to decide if a law was broken. That is why you report it when you hear about it. You don’t wait a year, you report now.

Many (not just at SI but out “there”), are acting like every instance of a boy unwantedly touching a girl’s private parts should lead to arrest, marking as a molester, isolation in a youth detention center, and significant psychological counseling. If you haven’t read what is being posted on many news sites about this, it is scary and over the top. I’m not sure about that. There is molestation, no doubt about it. There is also confusion and attention-seeking.

I’m appalled that you spend so much time defending a perpetrator. Have you once even thought about these young girls who had to live for years under the same roof with their abuser and wonder if they would again be awakened in the middle of the night by their older brother’s sexual violence towards them?

It seems his sisters have forgiven him.

I would question this. This is based on the words of the parents who followed Gothard’s teachings of quickly forgiving and moving along. It takes years and sometimes decades to come to grips of the sexual violation done to your body. Sometimes the real work of forgiveness comes as a young lady marries and has her own children. Read the article I posted earlier.

My sons are 6 and 2. I don’t go around telling them about molestation. Do you?

You are making some tremendous assumptions about me.

So, let’s all just stand around and shoot each other. Yea love!