Bob Jones University and the Bruins Foundation are hosting “An Evening with Tim Tebow”
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[mmartin]Do the same people questioning Tebow speaking at BJU have the same questions regarding past political candidates who also spoke there?
No, I don’t. The issue for me is Christian koinonia. Bringing in a political candidate is purely secular in nature. There is no fellowship or participation in the gospel. That person is not there to advance the gospel or Biblical Christianity or to share in those things. They are there to promote a political agenda.
But when you switch to preaching, or teaching Biblical truth, or sharing your testimony, or encouraging others in the Lord, you are engaging in Christian fellowship with that person. As a fundamentalist, I don’t think you should fellowship with someone who gives Christian recognition to gospel deniers and heretics – which is what you are doing when you participate in ministry with Catholics and Trinity-deniers. On top of that, I would also be very careful regarding the types of things such a speaker encourages through his actions. If those things are contrary to the new life that should be lived through the gospel, then I would try to find a better example to promote.
This isn’t new. Over 30 years ago BJU had Al Dark to speak in chapel (not even as a fundraiser or a special event). Al Dark was a professional baseball player who scored just ahead of the “shot heard round the world” and who later managed the A’s to two World Series. And to cap it off, he showed up at my 16th birthday party and regaled a bunch of high school boys with baseball stories for several hours.
Getting to … that to some NIU was held to a “higher” standard than BJU often is. (Jay often makes this point)
Yeah, unfortunately MMartin beat me to it this time. But I’ll bring it up next time, and any other time I get the opportunity to.
As someone who works in NY, I will also attest to Tebows’ witness and character in the white hot and decidedly hostile media spotlight. Is he perfect? Not by a long shot. But he works hard and is clear about his relationship with Jesus Christ. I will take his testimony and support any day over some of the people even in this thread.
Taylor Swift sums this situation up well:
And the haters gonna hate, hate, hate, hate, hate
Baby, I’m just gonna shake, shake, shake, shake, shake
I shake it off, I shake it off
Heartbreakers gonna break, break, break, break, break
And the fakers gonna fake, fake, fake, fake, fake
Baby, I’m just gonna shake, shake, shake, shake, shake
I shake it off, I shake it off
I am certain that BJU would prefer to remain open in the future. If you have better plans for raising money, preferably from the FBFI constituency, then I am certain someone at BJU will be happy to speak with them.
"Our task today is to tell people — who no longer know what sin is...no longer see themselves as sinners, and no longer have room for these categories — that Christ died for sins of which they do not think they’re guilty." - David Wells
[Jay] If you have better plans for raising money, preferably from the FBFI constituency, then I am certain someone at BJU will be happy to speak with them.
I suggest they get Don Johnson (picture in his younger years) [Im unable to verify that this is the FBFI Don Johnson :)]
Shame on you, Don!
Aspiring to be a stick in the mud.
I am a BJU grad and I am delighted that Tim Tebow is coming to BJU for a fundraiser. Living in CO, I watched this man (in the good old days when I watched the NFL) demonstrate Christ on and off the football field during his Bronco career. He never brought shame to the name above all names, Jesus.
Does he make every life style choice that I make? No, but I doubt if any of does.
From this corner of CO, I say go BJU as I take a Tebow knee.
A few people in this thread have said Tebow isn’t perfect - “not by a long shot.” Besides being a sinner like the rest of us, what do you mean by that?
Just curious.
I am curious about how those who have an issue with BJ inviting Tebow will now view BJU. Don has brought up some “big tent” (maybe even ecumenical) entanglements that Tebow has participated in. Since this is not a merely political or academic subject but is an issue of “Christian koinonia,” are we now to view BJU as going wholesale into compromising evangelicalism? If so, is it now time to separate? Is this the watershed moment for BJU and we might as well call them Masters College and Seminary East Coast? And if not, whats the difference?
My suspicion is that no one is really thinking that way because we can clearly perceive that the purpose of Tebow’s appearance is not primarily theological or even evangelical. He is coming to speak on the topic of faith in professional sports. And, at least for me, this is no different than BJ inviting Alan Keyes to speak because the purpose is clearly perceived. You may not agree with it, but lets not pretend that this is another evidence of BJ’s continual slide into the filthy dregs of modern, conservative, anti-eccumenical evangelicalism as opposed to our particular version of fundamentalism. This is something BJU has been doing since, nearly, its inception.
Phil Golden
And contrary to some, music is not a minor issue.
How did I know that eventually this thread would end up discussing music styles again?
Oh, wait, it’s because some fundamentalists don’t get excited about separation until someone brings up music.
Which is yet another point about the type of culture that is prized by some of our “brethren” that I have made over and over again.
"Our task today is to tell people — who no longer know what sin is...no longer see themselves as sinners, and no longer have room for these categories — that Christ died for sins of which they do not think they’re guilty." - David Wells
Jay: Bert introduced music to this thread, not me. Read the posts.
Wally Morris
Huntington, IN
I have not followed Tim Tebow that much. Nor do I care to, but are we viewing BJU as a church? The sports team for a non-denominational Christian college is having a Christian sports player speak at a fundraiser? I went to Morningside’s Sportsman Banquet in Greenville, when Jerry Clower spoke to the guys. He had some great things to say even though I am not sure I am aligned theologically with him. No one has questioned whether Tim Tebow is a Christian and no one has said he is a heretic. Just that in the past he was aligned to some groups that many of us may not agree with. I wouldn’t want him speaking at my church, but when did we elevate a para church organization to this level. This is now secondary separation at a para church level. I can’t judge his soul, I also haven’t heard him speak anything heretical, so what level are we judging him at? The layers of separation that we put here on earth will not be present in heaven.
“The layers of separation that we put here on earth will not be present in heaven.” Of course not. They won’t be necessary, but they are necessary here. That comment isn’t relevant at all.
So when did someone decide that separation applied only to churches? Doesn’t make sense. What if BJU (or Liberty University, for that matter) had the Pope speak at a sports fundraiser. Would that be OK since the forum is a school and not a church? Some of the arguments and responses in this discussion are irrelevant and give evidence of not understanding separation at all, which, of course, is the problem.
Wally Morris
Huntington, IN
Jay: Bert introduced music to this thread, not me. Read the posts.
That may be true, but it doesn’t shock me one bit that it came up.
Really, it’s all about the type of fundamentalist / fundamentalism in play.
"Our task today is to tell people — who no longer know what sin is...no longer see themselves as sinners, and no longer have room for these categories — that Christ died for sins of which they do not think they’re guilty." - David Wells
[WallyMorris]Jay: Bert introduced music to this thread, not me. Read the posts.
Technically, Don introduced it in his comment noting that he felt it was obnoxious that Tebow shared a stage with LeCrae. I don’t contest that music is important, but unless I can be persuaded that it’s an issue affecting the very Gospel, I’m reluctant to separate due to it. I can put up with a lot of music I don’t like and still maintain fellowship.
Aspiring to be a stick in the mud.
My take, regarding David’s question (and others I believe) about separation, if it’s a Gospel issue where falling on the wrong side sends you to Hell, certainly that distinction will exist in Heaven. On the other hand, if it’s other issues (like m-u-s-i-c and such), that distinction will be gone in Heaven.
Should schools practice it? Count me among those who view them as, properly speaking, extensions of the church, so if a school is for the Gospel, I’m fine with a degree of it. Not to the degree of separating from John Piper and such, but definitely from T.D. Jakes.
Aspiring to be a stick in the mud.
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