Bob Jones University and the Bruins Foundation are hosting “An Evening with Tim Tebow”

Jim,

I appreciate your graciousness toward BJU. I love the school and have sent many students there. I also appreciate Steve Davis, my longtime personal friend, for his willingness to give the benefit of the doubt to Tim’s progressive sanctification. As I said before, I admire Tim’s willingness to stand for the gospel and traditional marriage among other things. Realizing that this is an Athletic Fundraising Event as opposed to Bible Conference or a Chapel Service, some latitude should be given. My concern, however, is that Tim’s background has been in the broad spectrum of the Evangelical world. If one looks more carefully into his Christian associations and practices, they are different than the normal standards the University has held to for a Christian speaker who is there to give his Christian life and testimony. Tim is being presented, I believe, as an exemplary model for the young athletes et. al. at BJU. The standards for Christian leadership lend themselves toward the 18 characteristics of spiritual overseers outlined in 1 Timothy 3 and Titus 1. Based on what has been presented in this thread, I don’t think that Tim is there. A decision of this magnitude which has the potential of putting thousands of people in FMA to hear Tim has to be vetted more carefully. I don’t think it was. Thus, I believe it to be an unwise decision, perhaps very unwise.

I like sports. I think the intercollegiate sports program at BJU can help attract students, build character, build school unity and excitement. I voted for it. Nevertheless, there are dangers in the sports world such as wrong priorities, idolatry, hero-worship, compromise of standards, and so on. Years ago, my son started 3rd base at Clearwater for four years. The baseball program helped him in many ways. He is now a missionary pastor helping to plant a church in England. Sports developed his leadership, toughness, discipline, and helped him enjoy his college years. I would love for BJU to start a baseball program (right up there with Apple Pie and Chevrolet), especially since CCC is out of the picture. We must, however, maintain our biblical standards, philosophy, biblical discernment, and good judgment. I don’t think this decision is a trend of any sort. We shouldn’t read too much into it. Neither should we ignore it. If you are concerned, then let the folks at BJU know, but I would advise that you be gracious in your approach. You will accomplish more, I think, in the long run. Many great things have happened at BJU under the new administration which don’t get the press they should, but that’s human nature I guess.

Fundamentalist conniption fits:

I saw it coming:

[Don Johnson] I am extremely disappointed by this, though, alas, not surprised.

Change from the past and should be free:

[AndyE] … a departure from what they normally have done. Not fond of charging for something like this …

Observation: It’s a fundraiser … means they want to raise funds! Alas if only Chick-fil-A’s were free too! I’d be in heaven!

It’s strange and pointless:

[josh p] This does seem like a strange move. What’s the point?

Bad example and overemphasis on the wrong thing (sports here):

[Adam Blumer] sports is already overemphasized … shirtless … [not] an example for my kids

Observation: Probably every male in America enjoys being shirtless: swimming and other outdoor activities!

It’s idolatry and self-promotion

[Don Johnson] Little children, guard yourselves from idols. .. He uses his Christian testimony to promote his own notoriety

Who’s the idolater here? How does one know? Ditto with the self-promotion. By the way, Tebow has a foundation that has given millions away. Look it up! (Kind of a self-less act, I observe!)

I acknowledge that they have done something similar … but this is completely different

[Adam Blumer] Apples and oranges

Observation: It’s not unlike the other! But the important thing is that you are convinced!

Rumor has it:

[AndyE] In general I’ve been concerned that the intercollegiate sports program at BJU has been a drain on resources that might be better spent elsewhere.

Response: I’ve heard this argument before: John 12:3-5

Widen the appeal (in a negative way) … dress code (ditto) … and unfamiliar music:

[WallyMorris]

This is part of a wider strategy to broaden the appeal of BJU. … As more evidence of BJU’s change, I recently attended a statewide men’s meeting where Steve Pettit spoke. He brought an ensemble with him promoted as the “premier” ensemble from BJU. I didn’t recognize half of the music they played, and they were very casually dressed, the girls especially. Steve Pettit and others are changing BJU, and, quite frankly, there’s nothing anyone can do about it.

Response: You can always whine!

Sunday … S.u.n.d.a.y. … S.U.N.D.A.Y.

[Adam Blumer]

What about professional athletes and the local church, given how many pro games are on Sundays? Can a professional athlete still somehow be a faithful attender? Would this lifestyle conflict with the importance of the local church? I don’t know the answer to these questions but thought I’d toss the bone if somebody wants to bite it.

Summary: I don’t know for sure … but I doubt the man’s (Tebow’s) faithfulness

I’m not sure but …

[Adam Blumer]

I’m unsure that the values he represents are compatible with where we are in our faith. I’d hesitate to hold him up as a role model in spite of John 3:16 scrawled on his face.

Response: You sound “sure”

He’s a hack!

[GregH]

Who is Tim Tebow? A washed up NFL quarterback that never had a career and was fired from one team after another

Comment: Well he is a “celebrity hack” at least! (I think that’s an oxymoron!)

The old “Slippery slope”:

[WallyMorris]

The “real problem” is the changes current BJU administration are making in order to broaden the appeal and enrollment. These changes slowly but surely are changing the Biblical Fundamentalist nature of the school into something broadly conservative Evangelical. Yes, with these changes, BJU will survive. But survive as what? Apparently the BJU Board doesn’t see any problem with the changes. I imagine BJU students, staff, and alumni are split 50/50 on these changes, and the Administration has decided to go with the “broad appeal” in order to survive, assuming that those opposed will go away.

Also: I’m pretty sure that this really is not accepted by the majority (assume you studied this?!)

I’m due an explanation!

[WallyMorris] Was the Administration aware of Tebow’s speaking at the events Don outlined? If so, then an explanation of how & why BJU has changed its policies is due. If not, then that shows carelessness or unconcern.

Response: You’re so special!

Watershed?

[Philip Golden Jr.] it now time to separate? Is this the watershed moment for BJU

Response: It’ll be a watershed when they invite John MacArthur to speak at the Bible conference. I mean this in a positive way!

Motives:

[Don Johnson]

The fact that Jim saw fit to post this news item as a filing shows that something got his attention about it. Was he just trying to stir up comments here? Or is it because he is reacting to something that doesn’t seem to fit the BJU ethos we have known for so long?

Response: “There’s something happening here … What it is ain’t exactly clear “ [but whatever it is … it ain’t good!]

Christian colleges are dropping like flies. Some are immersed in serious financial and doctrinal scandal. BJU is trying to stay alive—honorably. And the naysayers are complaining because Tim Tebow is coming to give testimony about how he maintains a Christian testimony before a hostile world? Some people evidently have a different opinion than I concerning what it means to contend for the faith.

Our church had Steve Petit and a musical group from BJU back in October. It was outstanding! Our church was blessed and moved by the quality music from these young men and women. I can’t remember when I have been more proud of my alma mater. And yes, I didn’t recognize all the selections they used, but every one was God-centered and Christ exalting. I talked extensively to Dr. Petit an hour before the service, and to the students during a meal afterwards. Every one was humble, gracious, serious, and seemingly godly. If that was an example of the changes taking place at BJU, then I would have so say change seems to be in the direction of improvement, not decline. Actually, it will take more time to tell exactly what is happening at BJU and where it will be in five or ten years. I pray that it will still be standing true to God’s eternal Word! We need good Christian colleges more than ever in America today.

[G. N. Barkman]

I pray that it will still be standing true to God’s eternal Word! We need good Christian colleges more than ever in America today.

Greg, do you seriously think I disagree with that sentiment? I can’t believe you do.

Yet you are defending, in some measure at least, inviting Tim Tebow to speak as an example of a Christian maintaining his testimony. How well does he maintain his testimony in the links I provided above? Have you looked at them? Would you like the young people of your church to have that kind of testimony?

Don,

I’m having trouble understanding you. You pick one sentence out of my post and accuse me of saying that you disagree with it. It sounds to me like you are trying to find something with which you can pick a fight. I have read my post again, and for the life of me, I can’t figure out why you think I said anything about you, or anyone else for that matter, disagreeing with that statement. It was a public statement of my own personal desire, and I assume that everyone on SI shares the same desire.

Don, I have had a better opinion of you than that, so I’m going to forget this exchange, and assume that you are not that kind of person.

Warm regards,

Greg Barkman

Ok. Number one, I am agreeing with every sentiment you express in your post. I, too, hope the best for BJU.

However, you post it seemingly with the notion that we should just move on and not criticize BJU over this Tebow event. Am I reading you right? I don’t want to read you wrong, but that is the impression I get.

I don’t see how using Tim Tebow as an exemplary Christian testimony will achieve the ends you desire in your post. I agree with those ends. I hope they will be true. We need a strong BJU and strong Christian colleges in general. I just don’t see how this Tebow event will promote spiritual strength, and as such, I think BJU has made a serious mistake, a backwards step on the path to spiritual strength.

Do you see it the same way?

(I won’t be able to respond for some time, so don’t think I am just ignoring whatever you might say in response.)

Last week, while staying in a hotel, I was alone in the fitness center, watching Fox News while on the elliptical machine. Eventually, two ladies, younger than I, entered and began to exercise. One loudly asked me, “What are you watching?” “Fox News,” I replied. “Doesn’t it bother you to listen to propaganda?” she inquired. “What is propaganda? I responded. “Opinion instead of news,” was her reply. “What channel could we watch that is without opinion?” I asked. “Good point,” she said. “What channel would you rather watch?” I asked. “Something like NPR,” she replied. “I listen to NPR regularly,” I replied, “and it is filled with opinion. I’ll be done in a few minutes, and then you can switch to whatever channel you prefer.”

I wanted to say, “Doesn’t it bother you that you are emotionally unable to listen to an opinion with which you disagree?”

What’s my point? Let us stipulate for the record that Tim Tebow is not an Independent Fundamental Baptist. I do not believe students will be harmed by exposure to him. We should be able to listen to the opinions of others and evaluate them Biblically. That’s part of growing up. I have students at BJU. I have family at BJU. I expect to see some of my grandchildren attend BJU some day, Lord willing. If Tim Tebow is the worse thing they encounter, they will be fine. (I’m looking at my calendar. I see I will be speaking in Greenville on March 15, which I think is the day Tebow will speak. Hmmm. I wonder if I could manage to hear him myself?)

So far no one has said that TIM Tebow is not a Christian, although some of the disparaging remarks and attitude resemble those that should be reserved for apostates. Like Jim, there were things I did in ignorance as a new believer that were unacceptable. Thankfully I had Christian brothers and sisters who reached out to me in the spirit of Galatians 6:1-2 .”Brothers,a if anyone is caught in any transgression, you who are spiritual should restore him in a spirit of gentleness. Keep watch on yourself, lest you too be tempted. Bear one another’s burdens, and so fulfill the law of Christ.”

For too many years I’ve watched people point out the faults of other Christians without any effort to see them discipled and thereby gain a brother. I’ve heard the excuses for not reaching out to them and those excuses haven’t held water with me since the 80’s when, as the pastor of a small rural church, I sent a letter (yes, with a stamp and everything) to John MacArthur asking for an explanation of his statement on the blood of Christ. He sent me a real letter, explaining what he meant and introduced me to the word metonym.

Craig,

if you consider this a conniption fit you have obviously never had children:

It’s strange and pointless:

josh p wrote:

This does seem like a strange move. What’s the point?

[Jim]

Don Johnson wrote:

Yet you are defending, in some measure at least, inviting Tim Tebow to speak as an example of a Christian maintaining his testimony. How well does he maintain his testimony in the links I provided above? Have you looked at them? Would you like the young people of your church to have that kind of testimony?

Don: These are problematic connections and I grant you that! But judge him as one who is probably clueless that these associations are so. He has a degree from Florida State (no college-level Christian training). His associations were in ignorance.

Years ago as a brand new Christian I was on staff with what was formerly known as Campus Crusade for Christ. My training was a bachelor’s degree in economics and finance. A loving pastor - a BJU graduate, Dr Tom Hall - took me under his wings and guided me to a clearer understanding of these things.

A little quote for context…

So, yes, I have no problem with someone taking Tim under their wing and training him. That would be great.

I do have a problem with giving him a platform and setting him up as an example at this point in time. Consider this:

NAU 1 Timothy 3:6 and not a new convert, so that he will not become conceited and fall into the condemnation incurred by the devil.

KJV 1 Timothy 3:6 Not a novice, lest being lifted up with pride he fall into the condemnation of the devil.

I like the KJV word better here, the Greek is neofutos, we get neophyte from it.

Tebow needs instruction, he doesn’t need to be giving it.

I do have a problem with giving him a platform and setting him up as an example at this point in time. Consider this:

NAU 1 Timothy 3:6 and not a new convert, so that he will not become conceited and fall into the condemnation incurred by the devil.

There are at least three problems with this, Don.

1. Tebow isn’t an overseer / elder. He is a guest speaker.

2. This is a university setting, not a church.

3. The verse you are citing is completely out of context and irrelevant to what is going on.

Come on, Pastor Johnson. You know exegesis and hermeneutics better than this. Equating a guest speaker at Bob Jones University with an overseer in the church is akin to making me a doctor because I went to their office and picked up a prescription the other day.

Mike Harding wrote,

The standards for Christian leadership lend themselves toward the 18 characteristics of spiritual overseers outlined in 1 Timothy 3 and Titus 1. Based on what has been presented in this thread, I don’t think that Tim is there.

As a layman who hasn’t been to seminary (and usually reaches for Wiersbe, MacArthur, or the Bible Knowledge Commentary), I would like to see this discussion about those passages more fully developed, per Jay’s criticism. It appears that both Mike Harding and Don Johnson say 1 Timothy 3 does apply to Tim. But Jay says 1 Timothy 3, at least, doesn’t. Does this passage apply to Tim or not? Why or why not?

You don’t need to go deep into the Greek for this one. The context of I Timothy 3 is qualifications for church leaders:

Here is a trustworthy saying: Whoever aspires to be an overseer desires a noble task. - 1 Tim. 3:1 NIV

You simply cannot rip those verses out of the Bible and force them into this immediate discussion. You couldn’t do it even if BJU extended an offer for Tebow to teach a Seminary or University class of some sort.

This is not hard, and I am really, really surprised that men that I thought better of are doing this.

Either we care about the content and context of Scripture or we proof text our way to the positions we want to hold. I am not comfortable with the latter course.