Why Certain Types of Music Make Our Brains Sing, and Others Don’t
“our prediction of musical events remains inexorably bound to our musical upbringing. To explore this phenomenon, a group of researchers met with the Sámi people, who inhabit the region stretching between the northernmost reaches of Sweden and the Kola Peninsula in Russia.” - Neroscience News
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Rajesh, as a moderately educated person in the area of music, I challenge you; name a genre of music that has no links to the occult.
Hint; it’s not hymnody or classical music, because Be Still My Soul is linked to Nordic/Finnish paganism (and I believe Mormonism as well), Joyful Joyful We Adore Thee is an adaptation of Schiller’s pantheistic poem An Der Freude, and Morning has Broken has roots in Celtic pre-Christian theology. Luther’s hymnody also derives significantly from the popular songs of the time, which often retained pre-Christian themes in their original form, and of course Glorious Things of Thee are Spoken shares its tune with Deutschland Ueber Alles. Tchiakovsky does a lot with pagan themes (Rite of Spring, Petruschka, Firebird, etc..), and of course Mozart’s Magic Flute builds off these as well, as do most of the opera writers.
Ironically, the most “pure” art form might well be CCM, because of that genre’s habit of taking $5000 instruments and basically using them as a metronome while somebody whispers out the lyrics.
If you can prove otherwise, Rajesh, have at it, but I bet you can’t. I’ve actually read the yellow magazine and know better.
Aspiring to be a stick in the mud.
[Kevin Miller]See, right here. Your very next sentences show my point. It sounds like you are claiming that the Bible says occultists can’t be wrong since they transmit FULLY authentic information.How am I suppose to interpret that other than you claiming that occultists can’t be wrong?
And that is not the only other option.
Here again, it sounds like you are saying that occultists can never be wrong since we have no way of evaluating whether they are wrong. Actually, I think comparing some of their statements to Scripture is an excellent way of showing that they actually CAN be wrong. They can also be right, of course, but since you say that their statements can’t be evaluated, I’m not sure why you have such certainty that their information is FULLY authentic.
You obviously still do not understand what I am saying or what the Bible reveals.
Again, when God says that people are professional occultists, He is absolutely right, and they are fully authentic professional occultists. They engage in fully authentic occult practices. They have all the knowledge that they need to engage in all those fully authentic occult practices. They can and do make known to others that fully authentic information about what those fully authentic occult practices are and how to fully authentically engage in them.
If you deny any of this, you are saying that God is wrong when He speaks of those people as professional occultists. God is right. Anyone who denies what He says about those professional occultists is wrong.
[Kevin Miller]This is nonsense. When people engage in legitimate discussion, it is the responsibility of the one who provides information to document it. That’s fundamental etiquette in honest discourse. It is not the job of the ones receiving the information to have to go and search for the sources of such purportedly authentic information.Oh, spare me the theatrics. There is no legitimate reason you need a link to a source you could easily find yourself.
I may have shared some or most of this information in a previous thread. I believe that many believers do not properly understand just how dangerous professional occultists are.
The Fearful Malignity of a Professional Occultist
We must solemnly consider that Scripture reveals the horrific extent to which demons can corrupt humans in a passage that makes several key revelations about an ancient sorcerer:
Acts 13:6 And when they had gone through the isle unto Paphos, they found a certain sorcerer, a false prophet, a Jew, whose name was Barjesus: 7 Which was with the deputy of the country, Sergius Paulus, a prudent man; who called for Barnabas and Saul, and desired to hear the word of God. 8 But Elymas the sorcerer (for so is his name by interpretation) withstood them, seeking to turn away the deputy from the faith. 9 Then Saul, (who also is called Paul,) filled with the Holy Ghost, set his eyes on him, 10 And said, O full of all subtilty and all mischief, thou child of the devil, thou enemy of all righteousness, wilt thou not cease to pervert the right ways of the Lord?
This profound revelation is noteworthy for many reasons because of what it reveals about the fearful malignity of a professional occultist.
First, it says that he was a professional occultist (who was also a false prophet) who sought to turn away from the faith an unbeliever who wanted to hear God’s truth. Such people thus are profoundly dangerous to unbelievers.
Second, it infallibly reveals key truths about the sorcerer by infallibly recording what the leader of the apostolic company being filled with the Spirit [bold text is in italics in the original] said to the sorcerer. This shows that the statements that Paul made about the sorcerer were exactly what the Spirit directed him to say about the sorcerer. None of Paul’s statements about him were in any way just his own thinking, perspectives, or even possible biases against a particular kind of person because of that person’s ethnicity or any other important aspects of his person.
Third, it shows how consummately this human being was a corrupted human being.
Elymas was “full of all subtilty and all mischief.” He was a profoundly crafty and fraudulent person who used deceit to accomplish his objectives.
He was an “enemy of all righteousness.” He actively opposed everything that was an aspect of righteousness before God. He thus openly fought against the doing of anything that was righteous in the sight of God.
He also would “not cease to pervert the right ways of the Lord.” This man continually did whatever he could to corrupt the doing of something in a way that was right before God.
Fourth, and most disturbingly, he was a “child of the devil.” Through his involvement and participation in the occult, this man whom God made in His image had become so corrupted that he was now a child of the most evil being in the universe. In effect, the image of God in him had been completely overcome so that he effectively was a human being who was at least in some respects in the image of the devil!
This passage thus shockingly reveals that there are occultists (at the very least those who are sorcerers) who actively and passionately seek to promote demonic interests in every possible way!
Application
As believers, we must soberly and solemnly heed what God has revealed to us about the fearful malignity of this professional occultist. May God grant all of us grace to have nothing to do with such people and to have no fellowship with their unfruitful works of darkness (Eph. 5:11).
Admitting that practitioners of the occult can both lie and tell the truth, how can we discern whether their claims are true or false? Simple. If they agree with your already established premise, they’re telling the truth. If they contradict your premise, they’re lying!
"Some things are of that nature as to make one's fancy chuckle, while his heart doth ache." John Bunyan
[Ron Bean]Admitting that practitioners of the occult can both lie and tell the truth, how can we discern whether their claims are true or false? Simple. If they agree with your already established premise, they’re telling the truth. If they contradict your premise, they’re lying!
And Ron wins the thread.
[Dan Miller]And Ron wins the thread.
Instead of interacting edifyingly with the seriousness of the divine revelation in Acts 13, you have chosen to comment in this manner. May God open your eyes to truly see and acknowledge just how dangerous professional occultists truly are.
In any case, it certainly is true that many Christians who support the use of rock music perfectly display their biased approach to knowing what is true when they hold that professional occultists must be and are lying whenever they say things that go against what the pro-rock music Christians desperately want to believe are true.
Pink Floyd
but not for worship music
[Dave White]Pink Floyd
but not for worship music
According to the recent Homer Rodeheaver biography, Rodeheaver and many of his peers considered Gospel songs inappropriate for worship services, even though they made people’s brains sing.
"Some things are of that nature as to make one's fancy chuckle, while his heart doth ache." John Bunyan
[RajeshG]You are absolutely correct when you say I do not understand what you are saying. Believe me, I’m trying to understand it. Especially when you bring God’s truthfulness into the conversation.You obviously still do not understand what I am saying or what the Bible reveals.
Again, when God says that people are professional occultists, He is absolutely right, and they are fully authentic professional occultists. They engage in fully authentic occult practices. They have all the knowledge that they need to engage in all those fully authentic occult practices. They can and do make known to others that fully authentic information about what those fully authentic occult practices are and how to fully authentically engage in them.
If you deny any of this, you are saying that God is wrong when He speaks of those people as professional occultists. God is right. Anyone who denies what He says about those professional occultists is wrong.
How exactly are you defining “fully authentic”? Maybe that is where I am losing comprehension of your point. I understand “fully authentic” to mean “completely and totally real and true.” Something less than “fully real and true” would be “partially real and true.” It sounds like you are saying that professional occultists are giving fully true information (without error) about their fully real practices (without deception) and that God Himself claims this full truthfulness for professional occultists. If that is NOT what you are saying,then how are YOU defining “fully authentic.”
You must have some nuanced way of defining it, since in a later post, you describe a professional occultist as a “profoundly crafty and fraudulent person who used deceit to accomplish his objectives.”
[Dave White]Pink Floyd
Even as a kid (I was 10), they lost me with “We don’t need no education.”
[Dave White]Pink Floyd
but not for worship music
Pink Floyd is pretty polarizing; many love the tight bass lines, but get lost in the lyrics. (e.g. “me”) It’s probably a bit too complex for most praise teams to execute, and of course, you would need to use the genre but not the specific songs. It does serve as an example of how music of great technical skill can resonate in our culture decades after it was first released.
But that said, it would be a great improvement if church praise teams moved beyond the “two string, five fret” worship bass. If Psalms tells us to praise Him in dance, and He does, improving the bass (and percussion) lines isn’t the worst thing we can do. And getting greater skill in playing in churches is generally a huge need.
Aspiring to be a stick in the mud.
[Kevin Miller]I am at a loss to know how to help you understand more fully what the Bible reveals. What matters is not how I define something etc. What matters is what the Bible reveals. When God says that people were professional occultists (magicians, sorcerers, witches, wizards, people with familiar spirits, etc.), that is exactly what they were.You are absolutely correct when you say I do not understand what you are saying. Believe me, I’m trying to understand it. Especially when you bring God’s truthfulness into the conversation.
How exactly are you defining “fully authentic”? Maybe that is where I am losing comprehension of your point. I understand “fully authentic” to mean “completely and totally real and true.” Something less than “fully real and true” would be “partially real and true.” It sounds like you are saying that professional occultists are giving fully true information (without error) about their fully real practices (without deception) and that God Himself claims this full truthfulness for professional occultists. If that is NOT what you are saying,then how are YOU defining “fully authentic.”
You must have some nuanced way of defining it, since in a later post, you describe a professional occultist as a “profoundly crafty and fraudulent person who used deceit to accomplish his objectives.”
Perhaps it would help if you were to carefully go through every verse about the occult that I have compiled in this post: Verses about the Occult. Studying all of that material for yourself would give the Spirit the opportunity to use His Word to renew your mind and illumine it.
My “description” of a professional occultist was not really my description; it reflects exactly (as best as I am able) what the text in Acts 13 says about Elymas.
In a very telling statement, CCM has been characterized in this thread as a “genre” where “somebody whispers out the lyrics.”
Ironically, the most “pure” art form might well be CCM, because of that genre’s habit of taking $5000 instruments and basically using them as a metronome while somebody whispers out the lyrics.
To the extent that this statement is true, it shows plainly just how unbiblical CCM is because Scripture makes it plain that whispering out lyrics (excepting, of course, those who are physically incapable of singing aloud) has no place in acceptable corporate worship:
Psalm 81:1 Sing aloud unto God our strength: make a joyful noise unto the God of Jacob.
Several other related passages clearly support this command from God:
Ps. 51:14 Deliver me from bloodguiltiness, O God, thou God of my salvation: and my tongue shall sing aloud of thy righteousness.
Ps. 59:16 But I will sing of thy power; yea, I will sing aloud of thy mercy in the morning: for thou hast been my defence and refuge in the day of my trouble.
Ps. 149:5 Let the saints be joyful in glory: let them sing aloud upon their beds.
[RajeshG]Now you are the one not understanding. Did you even read my question? I’m not disputing that professional occultists exist nor that the Bible refers to them. I’m wondering how you can say that the information given by them outside of the Bible is “fully authentic” when the words “fully authentic” mean “100% accurate.” Do you really believe that they are NEVER wrong? That is what your words are saying!I am at a loss to know how to help you understand more fully what the Bible reveals. What matters is not how I define something etc. What matters is what the Bible reveals. When God says that people were professional occultists (magicians, sorcerers, witches, wizards, people with familiar spirits, etc.), that is exactly what they were.
Perhaps it would help if you were to carefully go through every verse about the occult that I have compiled in this post: Verses about the Occult. Studying all of that material for yourself would give the Spirit the opportunity to use His Word to renew your mind and illumine it.
My “description” of a professional occultist was not really my description; it reflects exactly (as best as I am able) what the text in Acts 13 says about Elymas.
Discussion