MacArthur v. Driscoll: It’s discouraging to young Christians like me

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James K's picture

Too bad Barnabas is such a whiner.

1 Kings 8:60 - so that all the peoples of the earth may know that the LORD is God and that there is no other.

Darrell Post's picture

From that link: "When younger Christians look to these prominent leaders, what do we see? We see discord between our shepherds and wedges being driven into the church over personal agendas and theological points that, while important, aren’t the heart of orthodoxy."

 

Strange, that isn't what I see or hear. So the issue of the work of the Holy Spirit is just a "personal agenda" and the Holy Spirit who is instrumental in our salvation, seals us, sanctifies us, and indwells us isn't the "heart of orthodoxy?" MacArthur should just toss out the constraints of Scripture just so there is no discord? This quote above from the article suggests to me that push comes to shove, the writer will go with Driscoll. Right there in that quote you see his elevation of harmony and dismissal of orthodoxy.

 

Mark_Smith's picture

This guy is either just writing an article so he says more than he really thinks, or he is like a cat distracted by the moving string of yarn! He actually wrote:

"To young Christians, like me, John MacArthur is known much more for what he is opposed to than for what he believes in."

 

Apparently this young man has never been to gty.org and listened to the 40+ years worth of sermons MacArthur makes available for free. And he has apparently never cracked open one of his NT commentaries, or read the MacArthur Study Bible, or read one of several dozens of books outlining what John MacArthur painstakingly makes clear what he believes.

TylerR's picture

Editor

Very telling that a young Christian's locus for Christian leadership is not the local church, but popular evangelical preachers. If this man is distressed, let him look away from para-church ministries and big name Christian leaders and cleave to his local church and seek wisdom from his own Pastor. 

We see discord between our shepherds and wedges being driven into the church over personal agendas and theological points that, while important, aren’t the heart of orthodoxy

He speaks of these men as his "shepherds." Ridiculous. His local church Pastor is his shepherd.

But this divisive nonsense hurts the church—real people who need and want to be led. It hurts to see beliefs and agendas wielded like weapons. What is it we ask for? We ask to be led, both in word and deed, toward humility and Christlikeness

This man has no Biblical concept of "the church." The Body of Christ is organized into local churches. If he seeks leadership, let him look to his Pastor and the mature Christians of his congregation - his own local church, which should have spiritual oversight over him.

I also think it is ridiculous to compare Driscoll to MacArthur. Like comparing a Yugo to a Mercedes. It speaks volumes about his discernment.

Tyler is a pastor in Olympia, WA and an Investigations Manager with a Washington State agency. He's the author of the book What's It Mean to Be a Baptist?

Andrew K.'s picture

TylerR wrote:

Very telling that a young Christian's locus for Christian leadership is not the local church, but popular evangelical preachers. If this man is distressed, let him look away from para-church ministries and big name Christian leaders and cleave to his local church and seek wisdom from his own Pastor. 

We see discord between our shepherds and wedges being driven into the church over personal agendas and theological points that, while important, aren’t the heart of orthodoxy

He speaks of these men as his "shepherds." Ridiculous. His local church Pastor is his shepherd.

But this divisive nonsense hurts the church—real people who need and want to be led. It hurts to see beliefs and agendas wielded like weapons. What is it we ask for? We ask to be led, both in word and deed, toward humility and Christlikeness

This man has no Biblical concept of "the church." The Body of Christ is organized into local churches. If he seeks leadership, let him look to his Pastor and the mature Christians of his congregation - his own local church, which should have spiritual oversight over him.

I also think it is ridiculous to compare Driscoll to MacArthur. Like comparing a Yugo to a Mercedes. It speaks volumes about his discernment.

With perhaps a few caveats on the latter part of your post, a hearty "AMEN!" to the former.

Who is MacArthur? Who is Driscoll? God's kingdom rewards faithfulness, not abilities. Get over your awe/disappointment at the Celebrity Pastors talents and failings and consider the Kingdom of Heaven super-stardom of your local pastor as he visits the ill and unwanted, holding the hand of the dying in hospitals and kneeling with the inmate in prison year by year.

神是爱

Matthew Richards's picture

MacArthur v. Driscoll: It’s encouraging to young Christians like me

Dave Gilbert's picture

TylerR wrote:

Very telling that a young Christian's locus for Christian leadership is not the local church, but popular evangelical preachers. If this man is distressed, let him look away from para-church ministries and big name Christian leaders and cleave to his local church and seek wisdom from his own Pastor. 

We see discord between our shepherds and wedges being driven into the church over personal agendas and theological points that, while important, aren’t the heart of orthodoxy

He speaks of these men as his "shepherds." Ridiculous. His local church Pastor is his shepherd.

But this divisive nonsense hurts the church—real people who need and want to be led. It hurts to see beliefs and agendas wielded like weapons. What is it we ask for? We ask to be led, both in word and deed, toward humility and Christlikeness

This man has no Biblical concept of "the church." The Body of Christ is organized into local churches. If he seeks leadership, let him look to his Pastor and the mature Christians of his congregation - his own local church, which should have spiritual oversight over him.

I also think it is ridiculous to compare Driscoll to MacArthur. Like comparing a Yugo to a Mercedes. It speaks volumes about his discernment.

 

I would go further and stress that a young believer look to the Bible first, testing everything with it, and then to his / her pastor...even pastors can be fallible and in need of correction due to the flesh that we cart around. Wink

 

In addition, a Christian's leadership is in Christ, who is our Head...they should be looking there for leadership, IMO.

 

As for the article, it can be said ( and often has ) that both men are false teachers...Why Mr. Piper is looking to mere men for leadership puzzles me, if he's truly born again. However, I remember when I was a new believer and looked to my former pastor for his wisdom and experience with God's word...and I found much to guide me further into truth.

One thing that bothers me about his article: " We want to respect John MacArthur and Mark Driscoll. God gifted them and has saved many through their ministries and grown many more. But this divisive nonsense hurts the church—real people who need and want to be led. It hurts to see beliefs and agendas wielded like weapons. What is it we ask for? We ask to be led, both in word and deed, toward humility and Christlikeness. Show us how to believe strongly, have convictions, and share them, not fight over them. That is what we would truly respect. "

 

I see quite a bit here, including ecumenism, to raise a flag about...I truly hope that Barnabas Piper is not looking to anyone but God to grow him into Christlikeness, because the Holy Ghost is the only one who can.

 

Finally, one passage that seems to apply: 1 Corinthians 1:11-31

 

Dave.