Texas Church to Host Handgun License Class

Two years ago our church hosted a concealed carry class for our members who were interested.

In my opinion, the church has no business hosting these types of events. If members wish to attend a course like this on their own, that’s their prerogative. However, churches encouraging their members to attend so that they can ” feel more secure about where they are” is, again in my opinion, a form of idolatry. In a real sense, their sense of safety is in possessing a weapon and not in God.

I believe a church and individual believers are perfectly within their rights to get a concealed carry permit and to have a gun and know how to use it.

Preachers of the Old West commonly carried a gun when they felt it was needed. In some situations the most loving thing a Christian could do is to use a gun to protect the innocent. We should depend on God, but sometimes we are to also act in our defense.

If someone began shooting people in my church, I’d be delighted if a good guy in the congregation had a gun and took care of the shooter.

http://gulfcoastpastor.blogspot.com/2012/12/gun-control-in-light-of-con…
David R. Brumbelow

I think one of our goals should be to remove all obstacles to the gospel, save the gospel itself (and the sanctification that it engenders). So does this church help or hurt the spread of the gospel by offering the concealed carry class? I think it is an unnecessary encumbrance to the main mission of the church.

• Concealed Carry Class
• Financial Peace “University”
• Quilting class

• 
  Concealed Carry Class - divisive political hot button


• 
  Financial Peace “University” - a step in Christian sanctification (wise use of God’s money), a bridge from a felt need to spiritual need, NOT a political hot button


• 
  Quilting Class - non-divisive benign aid to fellowship

Good points and thank you for them.

Considering that it is TEXAS … I’m not sure how divisive it is! But I may be wrong!

Thanks

Texas - Isn’t that where the Church Constitution requires you to be Republican, have a CCW, and play the guitar in order to be welcomed into fellowship? ;)

Interesting juxtaposition here. In this thread, we are advised to avoid a CCW class at church because it might unnecessarily hinder the Gospel message. In another thread, the argument is being made that getting rid of a label that some find unnecessarily hindering the Gospel is wrong.

Many churches allow portions of the building, like a Fellowship Hall, to be used for meetings of community interest, and rent the space for anything that isn’t immoral or illegal.

There are a couple of local churches that host Scout meetings, co-ops, junior league sports teams, karate classes, craft shows, etc… if a church allows their building to be used in these ways, and there is interest in a CCW class, I don’t see that it should be a big deal.

From my current reading and pondering over James, I think this is an issue where we are not the judges of this church.

James 4:11-12 Don’t speak evil against each other, dear brothers and sisters. If you criticize and judge each other, then you are criticizing and judging God’s law. But your job is to obey the law, not to judge whether it applies to you. God alone, who gave the law, is the Judge. He alone has the power to save or to destroy. So what right do you have to judge your neighbor?

However, I would like to push a little deeper, too, and ask a few questions of this church and of ourselves. My mom, recently returned to the U.S. from their 12-yrs in Africa as missionaries, was very saddened that our church/christian school responded to the shooting tragedy by locking the church doors after the service started, locking nursery doors, offering to get handguns for the school personnel… . . No one started a prayer meeting. No one expressed the ultimate belief that our lives are in God’s hands.

Also, while I do fully support the freedom to bear arms that is one of the keys of American freedom (I think more for the purpose of being able to go to war to protect itself against a tyrannical government), I wish that American believers in my circles would openly listen to and consider the pacifistic aspects of Biblical teaching. My husband, a Ukrainian, was pacifistic at the time we met and were married, as were all baptists in Ukraine at that time, and I have come to highly respect his very careful considerations about the valid and Christlike use of force in personal situations.

Just some thoughts ;)

[Chip Van Emmerik]

Interesting juxtaposition here. In this thread, we are advised to avoid a CCW class at church because it might unnecessarily hinder the Gospel message. In another thread, the argument is being made that getting rid of a label that some find unnecessarily hindering the Gospel is wrong.

Very good point. While I think that the CCW class and the “Baptist” name are small issues, and that the correct decisions regarding them will vary from situation to situation, the general principle should be to hold up the gospel, and not hinder it. Keep to the primary mission, and don’t put on ankle weights before you run a race.

There is no theological argument against this that cannot be made against any church activity that goes beyond preaching, evangelism, baptism/the Lord’s Supper, singing songs (of the psalm and hymn variety only and without musical accompaniment) and taking offerings to aid members of the congregation in financial distress and provide a small amount of compensation for the pastor. Anything else - everything else - can be a stumblingblock in the hearts of one who wishes to make it so.

You have a righteous obligation to protect and defend your loved ones. From a robber or tyranny of the ruling elite… Even if you have to hold your nose while pulling the trigger it is your constitutional and biblical duty to meet evil with righteous force. Be prepared, unite and defend with lethal prayer and a Sig.

~David had a sling and stones. Do you recall what Israel was doing? Knees knocking in fear…until the giant was handed his head, with God’s blessing.

I live a few miles away from the church that suffered 7 deaths in their youth group about 10 years ago. It’s preventable, folks. Get your CWP ASAP…

[Anne Sokol]

From my current reading and pondering over James, I think this is an issue where we are not the judges of this church.

James 4:11-12 Don’t speak evil against each other, dear brothers and sisters. If you criticize and judge each other, then you are criticizing and judging God’s law. But your job is to obey the law, not to judge whether it applies to you. God alone, who gave the law, is the Judge. He alone has the power to save or to destroy. So what right do you have to judge your neighbor?

However, I would like to push a little deeper, too, and ask a few questions of this church and of ourselves. My mom, recently returned to the U.S. from their 12-yrs in Africa as missionaries, was very saddened that our church/christian school responded to the shooting tragedy by locking the church doors after the service started, locking nursery doors, offering to get handguns for the school personnel… . . No one started a prayer meeting. No one expressed the ultimate belief that our lives are in God’s hands.

Also, while I do fully support the freedom to bear arms that is one of the keys of American freedom (I think more for the purpose of being able to go to war to protect itself against a tyrannical government), I wish that American believers in my circles would openly listen to and consider the pacifistic aspects of Biblical teaching. My husband, a Ukrainian, was pacifistic at the time we met and were married, as were all baptists in Ukraine at that time, and I have come to highly respect his very careful considerations about the valid and Christlike use of force in personal situations.

Just some thoughts ;)

Anne,

I don’t think it’s a good idea for churches to host these types of gun training events. They can send unintentional messages to the community regarding what the church is really about, much the same way any other extracurricular activity might.

But I do think it would be good for individual members to head up this kind of protective operation. I’ve done it myself with members of my church. I take people shooting, train them, consult with them on the best gun to get, while still keeping children safe from accidents. Here are some thoughts to answer your thoughts.

- We don’t need to always set up prayer *meetings* to show we’re serious about wanting God to protect us.

- God ordains ends, and he also ordains means to those ends. Praying for God’s protection is one of those means, but why couldn’t obtaining a firearm and knowing how to use it be one of those means? If the mother who was recently protecting her children from an home intruder in Georgia in her closet was praying to God “protect me!!!” and she didn’t have her revolver with her, God might say to her “I was. I gave you a revolver for you to protect yourself.” Thankfully she had the revolver and protected her kids with it. Would we say that God protected her in that circumstance? Of course. He was there all the time making sure her kids obeyed, she could collect her nerves enough to use it ect. God ultimately protected her, but he used means of force. The Bible is full of language about how we should be defending the fatherless and widows. I submit that those this weaker class needed protection from actually needed to be kicked, punched or struck in the course of that defense in ancient Israel. So it is today. We can pray that God will help the building program, and he may just use us to put feet to our prayers by getting to work.

- Non-violence is great at treating systemic societal ills or in taking *religious* persecution as Jesus did. If a man tries to beat me up for my faith, I can and probably should be non-violent about that. If he’s breaking into a house because he just wants to to rape my wife, then that puts the moral arithmetic in a very different category, and now responsibilities stack up on the side of me protecting innocent life, yes even by taking a non-innocent one who’s given his life forfeit by acting in an immediately threatening way.