Evangelical Leaders React to Mohler Supporting Trump

[Jay]

David French did a terrific job of dissecting this carcass on his blog yesterday

https://frenchpress.thedispatch.com/p/evangelicals-have-abandoned-the-ch…

And Resurgent agreed with him and made some more salient points of their own today:

https://theresurgent.com/2020/04/20/david-french-was-right/

Thanks Jay for putting this up. French’s article was excellent although I don’t believe it will convince anyone. Anyone who has been “all in” with Trump to this point is not going to be convinced no matter how reasonable the argument.

there’s zeal for political parties and leaders, and zeal for principles. I aim to be as guilty as I can be of the latter.

Aaron,

Is it possible anyone can be have a zeal for principles and disagree with you? What if the principle you aim to be guilty of is a bad principle? Does that justify it?

I don’t look for nor do I expect any kind of paradise while living as an exile in a strange land. And I vote (or abstain from voting) as an exile that serves a King who expects my allegiance to His ethics and His kingdom. Last I checked, those ethics do not include pragmatic compromise in order to protect my “American Dream.”

French’s article was excellent

What kind of standard are we using to call “excellent” article that is filled with untruth and misleading arguments? How is this any different than Trump apart from agreeing with you?

[Larry]

French’s article was excellent

What kind of standard are we using to call “excellent” article that is filled with untruth and misleading arguments? How is this any different than Trump apart from agreeing with you?

“We” aren’t calling it excellent. I am. I believe it’s excellent because it points out the “win-at-all-costs” methodology of a lot of evangelical Christians. You of course are free to highlight those misleading arguments. As far as how it’s different than Trump, well he hasn’t argued like a petulant child so that’s one thing. He also hasn’t resorted to insults and disrespect.

From French: “Listen to Mohler’s announcement, and you’ll hear a narrow political philosophy—one that’s limited to evaluating a party platform on a few, discrete issues. It’s nothing more than a policy checklist. He speaks of religious freedom, LGBT issues, and abortion.” Narrow political philosophy, few discrete issues! Really? With no apologies, that’s enough for me to want a candidate who will work to protect life. Character, competence. Let me know when you find someone electable. I really don’t care who others vote for or think I need to persuade them of my moral superiority in my choice. In our own church, in our own leadership team we probably have differences of opinion in who to vote for. It’s not an issue that divides us. I don’t think any of us care much for Trump. We also don’t care at all for the alternative. In the end, our hope is not in government, the best or the worse. Maybe I’ve seen too much (or too little). I’ve lived in Western Europe and post-Communist Romania. I’ve spent time in Russia, China, Moldova, Vietnam, etc. I travel regularly to an African country with same the president for over 35 years since independence. It’s not perfect here but we still have a pretty good system. Four more years or no more years. At least we get to vote. I think many Christians on all sides. waste far too much time complaining and posturing.

[Larry]

French’s article was excellent

What kind of standard are we using to call “excellent” article that is filled with untruth and misleading arguments? How is this any different than Trump apart from agreeing with you?

I was thinking the same thing. I’ve liked a lot of what French has written in the past, but he went way off the rails here…

[John E.]

I don’t look for nor do I expect any kind of paradise while living as an exile in a strange land. And I vote (or abstain from voting) as an exile that serves a King who expects my allegiance to His ethics and His kingdom. Last I checked, those ethics do not include pragmatic compromise in order to protect my “American Dream.”

I don’t expect the U.S. to be any sort of Christian paradise either. I just don’t see it as a “pragmatic compromise” to vote for less evil and policies that more closely align with “allegiance to His ethics and His kingdom.”

Just because Trump’s evil is different than Biden’s that doesn’t make it less. And, in the balance, most of Trump’s policies do not reflect Kingdom ethics.

[John E.]

Just because Trump’s evil is different than Biden’s that doesn’t make it less. And, in the balance, most of Trump’s policies do not reflect Kingdom ethics.

If you believe that then we disagree.

In bullet point listings, in other words please don’t write a long article, give a few reasons Trump is worse than previous presidents.

As for me:

1- I think the claim of his lying is exaggerated. The lists with over 20,000 lies is patently ridiculous.

2- I love limiting illegal immigration. We should have 0 illegal immigration.

3- Race oriented politics divides us. Calling that out is ok by me.

“in the balance, most of Trump’s policies do not reflect Kingdom ethics.”

That statement makes it sound as if it is okay to vote for someone whose policies are not 100% “kingdom ethics” but whose policies are by some estimation more Kindgom-conforming than not (>50%?).

Wondering how the policies are weighted and ultimately how one can end up voting for a candidate that still has non-Kingdom-ethics-conforming policies. The balance approach seems to be of the same stripe as the lesser of two evils approach.

FWIW, I’ve never voted for a presidential candidate that I judged to have view and policies that were 100% in line with a thorough biblical worldview.

Thanks for the perspective.

Just because Trump’s evil is different than Biden’s that doesn’t make it less.

This reminds me of the line from the Fellowship of the Ring movie, when Saruman tries to corrupt Gandalf:

You did not seriously think that a Hobbit could contend with the will of Sauron? There are none who can. Against the power of Mordor, there can be no victory. We must join with him, Gandalf. We must join with Sauron. It would be wise, my friend.