Is Soul Sleep bad?

I soul slept in church last week

Started at about 12 min into the sermon. Missed the last 7 sermon points. Woke up when my wife elbowed me just before the invitation

Left church refreshed!

Oh that’s not what you meant by soul sleep?! Never mind! :)

In case you are interested, I wrote a blog article some time ago called “A Defense of a Conscious Intermediate State” that discusses the various Biblical passages involved, along with the particularly problematic hermeneutical approach of the advocates of soul sleep. I think it may answer your questions. Here is the link:

http://reformedbaptist.blogspot.com/2009/10/defense-of-conscious-interm…

Let me know if this helps or if you have further questions.

Christian,

I think it is easy to talk past one another on an issue such as this because people don’t always define terms the same way. I think this may be what led to the misunderstanding you allude to in the opening of your last post.

I never said that those who have died are now unconscious. I merely said that according to scripture, they are asleep. I know that those who sleep can still think and feel(e.g. dreams).

You will notice that I never said that you said that the spirits of those who have died are now unconscious. You titled the thread “Is soul sleep bad?” and the term “soul sleep” has a pretty standard theological meaning. All the people I have ever dealt with who advanced soul sleep as a doctrine have taught that it refers to an unconscious state of the souls/spirits of the dead while they await resurrection. I simply thought that this was what you were talking about and that, therefore, the article I had written on the subject might apply to your question. If you are using the term in a different way, that is fine by me.

The passage that you used from Revelations, about the saints under the altar, can also be seen as symbolic/metaphoric- since it would not seem possible for people to be literally underneath an altar. You criticize the soul sleep camp for pushing metaphors to far. You notice also that the saints are told to “rest a little while longer, until both the number of their fellow servants and their brethren, who would be killed as they were, was completed.”

First, I have indeed criticized the soul sleep camp for pushing the metaphor of sleep as applied to the dead too far, and I stand by that criticism for the reasons I cited in the article.

Second, I of course didn’t base my own view simply on the text in Revelation 6. In fact, I wouldn’t even say that it is one of my primary texts on the matter. I also want to point out that I discussed the issue of symbolism in the article when I said:

It is hard to imagine how John’s vision of the souls under the alter cannot be seen as teaching a conscious intermediate state for those who have died in the Lord. Of course, I suppose one could argue that this is a highly symbolic passage, and that we must not take it as a literal reference to actual disembodied souls. But I would respond by asking what this reference then symbolizes, if not the existence of conscious spirits in the intermediate state?

In addition, while I agree that it “would not seem possible for people to be literally underneath an altar,” I would simply note that the text does not say that people were under or below the altar. John specifically says, “I saw under the altar the souls of those who had been slain for the word of God and for the testimony which they held” (Rev. 6:9). This is a reference to the souls of people who have died and have not yet been resurrected, and I see no reason why we should assume that the same kind of spacial limitations should apply to them. However, I do believe that it is best to assume a symbolic meaning as to their location in relationship to the altar, perhaps as an indication that they are viewed as having given their lives as a sacrifices to God. At any rate, I would seek to understand what the symbolic reference is just as I would seek to understand the meaning of the metaphor of sleep as applied to the dead, about which I wrote at some length in my article. I see no contradiction in my approach here. I am simply attempting to understand each text in its own context.

I do not believe that body and soul are inseparable. Naturally, they are separated from each other at death. But that is why the souls are put into a state of sleep, or rest. So that they can rest until the day of the Lord and resurrection of the dead.

First, I am not sure why you write, “I do not believe that body and soul are inseparable,” and then say in the very next line that “Naturally, they are separated from each other at death.” Wouldn’t that mean that they are, then, separable?

Second, having agreed that the body and soul are indeed separated at death, I wonder why you say that the souls are then “put into a state of sleep, or rest.” I know of no Scripture passage that says that the souls of the dead are asleep.

I am also not sure why you equate sleep with rest as you do. For example, one is certainly resting when asleep, but one may be resting without being asleep as well. So, when God says to the souls under the altar that they “they should rest a little while longer” (Rev. 6:11), I see no reason to assume that this means that they are thought of as sleeping, especially given the fact that they are actively crying out to God with an awareness of what He is or is not doing.

And we must also take into account that when a person dies, ‘time’ might not exist as it does now. So it may be that for the dead, the resurrection seems to happen almost immediately.

Well, I am not sure how much this bit of speculation fits with the text you have mentioned in Revelation 6, since the souls under the altar are pictured as being aware of the passage of time — at least to some extent — for they cry out to God with the question, “How long, O Lord, holy and true, until You judge and avenge our blood on those who dwell on the earth?” (Rev. 6:10).

I will finish by pointing out that the text you cite at the end of your post — 1 Cor. 15:52 — does not have to do with the time between the deaths of believers and their subsequent resurrections; it has to do primarily with the the change that will occur in those who are alive when Christ returns and with those who are resurrected at that time. It is simply speaking of the suddenness of this change when it happens. So I don’t see what it has to do with the point you were making.

In Christ,

Keith