Healthcare, Welfare and the Independent Fundamental Baptist
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Forgive me if I should not being doing this, but I made this post on my blog and I would like to discuss it.
Healthcare is a hot topic for debate. Christians are horrified about the thought of government taking over the system. Lack of government control is our motto, our heritage our foundation that made America and made us great. I agree with that. However, when irresponsible citizens don’t take care of their responsibilities then the government has this nasty tendency to step in and take charge. It started as relief mainly in the 1930’s during the great depression, but has now spiraled down hill to any sad situation.
Universal healthcare is good, is it bad, is it needed? Yes, No, Maybe.
The hardest hit isn’t the poor. It isn’t the under privilege. It isn’t the pregnant teenager, the old widow that only work was that of a faithful house wife. It isn’t the military veteran that hit rock the bottom from the effects of post traumatic stress disorder. The hardest hit is our middle income workers. It’s the self employed. The “Oh my family will never get sick” people. It’s the Christians that have “Faith” God will take care of them crowd.
1Timothy 5:8 But if any provide not for his own, and specially for those of his own house, he hath denied the faith, and is worse than an infidel.
Many of us old time Bible Thumping Independent Fundamental Baptist would wave a hanky and yelp a hearty Amen to that. We care for our own. If we don’t we are a scum bag, slimy bum. We don’t accept no welfare. We want no government involvement, we want no government hand outs. We will work to care for our own, right. Right? Is that how it is? How about healthcare? Oh our family is well cared for. They have the nice clothes, the name brand shoes, the fancy home that could be picture perfect from a Midwest Living Magazine. The cars we drive are nice. We go out to eat once a week, or maybe once a month. And of course, the most important, our tithe is in the offering plate every Sunday morning.
We are such good Christians and our family is well cared for. That is until Jenny, sweet little Jenny she gets that belly ache, starts a fever, vomiting. Eyes filled with tears, and can barely walk, doubled over in pain. What to do. she gets weaker, the pain is great, and then then that unexpected Emergency Room visit is needed. First they do the IV, they draw some labs, the urine test came back fine, the CBC elevated, they the CT Scan is ordered. Jenny is showing a sign of relief with some morphine on board and liter of fluids in. It still hurts when she tries to readjust herself. The pain is more bareable now. The results come in the emergency appendectomy is scheduled. Little Jenny must face surgery then a hospital stay. But there is no insurance, who pays? Do we let Jenny die, or do the surgery? Well I tithe, I am a good Christian, I have faith God will take care of us.
Jenny is better she is out playing jumping and skipping rope. The bill comes it $5647. The surgeon bill comes in $546. The astheiologist bill arrives $323. The ER doctor bill arrives $234. Oh my well how will I pay for this? So you say a prayer, ask for God’s help, then you go to the hospital and talk with the finance office. You explain you have no insurance, you make so much money, bring in check stubs, you ask for assistance. You don’t tell them how much your house is worth, the type of cars you drive, or about the nice vacation you took six months prior. They don’t look in your wardrobe, your freezer or even meet you for dinner. But you want assistance. Maybe a sliding scale according to your income, or just a complete forgiveness of your debt. You want time to pay, preferably without interest, knowing when times get tight, this will be the last billed paid. You explain that due to religious convictions you refuse to sign up for public aid. After all Phillipians 4:19 But my God shall supply all your need according to his riches in glory by Christ Jesus.
So what is the problem? Isn’t this what every good Christian does? I am caring for my family. I am not an infidel? Does your employer offer healthcare? Are you self employed? How is your family insured? Are you independently wealthy and can pay without any difficulty? Do you budget health care in your finances? Health care spending accounts are an awesome way to care for your family. Do you have anything like that? Do you live in a nice house, drive a decent car? Do you realize that not caring for your family and that includes healthcare is just as bad as not tithing in God’s eyes?
The problem that our country is experiencing in Healthcare is the middle income families that opt out of healthcare coverage instead of paying premiums to be insured. There is no such thing as free healthcare, no such thing. It isn’t free, it has to be paid for by someone. As a nurse I am thankful for that. I didn’t go into nursing for my love and compassion of people. I became a nurse solely for the financial benefit of it. I worked my butt to gain that and sacrifice as well. I wasn’t born with a silver spoon with advantages. I was born with a rusted spork told how to use it. So why should I have to pay for someone else not doing the same?
Well my employer doesn’t pay for healthcare, or I am self employed. No excuse. McDonalds pays for insurance, get a job somewhere that will. “But it pays well” then buy your own insurance, or at least have a health care spending account. I am self employed, either insure your self, or work for someone that will insure you. They are excuses, nothing more, nothing less.
When you refuse public aid, but ask for financial assistance you are still getting welfare. Oh Maybe not government run, but it is still welfare. Your lack of paying, is what is increasing my insurance premiums. You are taking my money without my permission, just like the public aid assistance increases our tax rates. It is just another tax one you don’t have to pay, but I do. This why hospital bills are so inflated.
Now the argument can be made that it isn’t fair. I am not being rationale because I have never been there, I have good insurance so I don’t understand.HMM a few years ago I finished paying off a $10,000 hospital bill because of lack of insurance. The lack wasn’t really on purpose, we were supposed to have Cobra Coverage but it wasn’t explained and completed correctly. I ended up not only paid for Samantha’s birth, but 7 weeks later, her septic work up, from a seizure status post a breath holding spell that made her stop breathing due to an immature of CNS that didn’t stimulate her to breath, caused her to turn blue and limp, and pretty much dead in my arms. Praise God I just renewed my CPR and it was fresh in my mind. Been there done that I understand.
See you have Faith, you trust in God to care for you. The problem is, you really don’t have faith, God has taken care of you. You just refused what He offered that was healthcare coverage.
Healthcare is a hot topic for debate. Christians are horrified about the thought of government taking over the system. Lack of government control is our motto, our heritage our foundation that made America and made us great. I agree with that. However, when irresponsible citizens don’t take care of their responsibilities then the government has this nasty tendency to step in and take charge. It started as relief mainly in the 1930’s during the great depression, but has now spiraled down hill to any sad situation.
Universal healthcare is good, is it bad, is it needed? Yes, No, Maybe.
The hardest hit isn’t the poor. It isn’t the under privilege. It isn’t the pregnant teenager, the old widow that only work was that of a faithful house wife. It isn’t the military veteran that hit rock the bottom from the effects of post traumatic stress disorder. The hardest hit is our middle income workers. It’s the self employed. The “Oh my family will never get sick” people. It’s the Christians that have “Faith” God will take care of them crowd.
1Timothy 5:8 But if any provide not for his own, and specially for those of his own house, he hath denied the faith, and is worse than an infidel.
Many of us old time Bible Thumping Independent Fundamental Baptist would wave a hanky and yelp a hearty Amen to that. We care for our own. If we don’t we are a scum bag, slimy bum. We don’t accept no welfare. We want no government involvement, we want no government hand outs. We will work to care for our own, right. Right? Is that how it is? How about healthcare? Oh our family is well cared for. They have the nice clothes, the name brand shoes, the fancy home that could be picture perfect from a Midwest Living Magazine. The cars we drive are nice. We go out to eat once a week, or maybe once a month. And of course, the most important, our tithe is in the offering plate every Sunday morning.
We are such good Christians and our family is well cared for. That is until Jenny, sweet little Jenny she gets that belly ache, starts a fever, vomiting. Eyes filled with tears, and can barely walk, doubled over in pain. What to do. she gets weaker, the pain is great, and then then that unexpected Emergency Room visit is needed. First they do the IV, they draw some labs, the urine test came back fine, the CBC elevated, they the CT Scan is ordered. Jenny is showing a sign of relief with some morphine on board and liter of fluids in. It still hurts when she tries to readjust herself. The pain is more bareable now. The results come in the emergency appendectomy is scheduled. Little Jenny must face surgery then a hospital stay. But there is no insurance, who pays? Do we let Jenny die, or do the surgery? Well I tithe, I am a good Christian, I have faith God will take care of us.
Jenny is better she is out playing jumping and skipping rope. The bill comes it $5647. The surgeon bill comes in $546. The astheiologist bill arrives $323. The ER doctor bill arrives $234. Oh my well how will I pay for this? So you say a prayer, ask for God’s help, then you go to the hospital and talk with the finance office. You explain you have no insurance, you make so much money, bring in check stubs, you ask for assistance. You don’t tell them how much your house is worth, the type of cars you drive, or about the nice vacation you took six months prior. They don’t look in your wardrobe, your freezer or even meet you for dinner. But you want assistance. Maybe a sliding scale according to your income, or just a complete forgiveness of your debt. You want time to pay, preferably without interest, knowing when times get tight, this will be the last billed paid. You explain that due to religious convictions you refuse to sign up for public aid. After all Phillipians 4:19 But my God shall supply all your need according to his riches in glory by Christ Jesus.
So what is the problem? Isn’t this what every good Christian does? I am caring for my family. I am not an infidel? Does your employer offer healthcare? Are you self employed? How is your family insured? Are you independently wealthy and can pay without any difficulty? Do you budget health care in your finances? Health care spending accounts are an awesome way to care for your family. Do you have anything like that? Do you live in a nice house, drive a decent car? Do you realize that not caring for your family and that includes healthcare is just as bad as not tithing in God’s eyes?
The problem that our country is experiencing in Healthcare is the middle income families that opt out of healthcare coverage instead of paying premiums to be insured. There is no such thing as free healthcare, no such thing. It isn’t free, it has to be paid for by someone. As a nurse I am thankful for that. I didn’t go into nursing for my love and compassion of people. I became a nurse solely for the financial benefit of it. I worked my butt to gain that and sacrifice as well. I wasn’t born with a silver spoon with advantages. I was born with a rusted spork told how to use it. So why should I have to pay for someone else not doing the same?
Well my employer doesn’t pay for healthcare, or I am self employed. No excuse. McDonalds pays for insurance, get a job somewhere that will. “But it pays well” then buy your own insurance, or at least have a health care spending account. I am self employed, either insure your self, or work for someone that will insure you. They are excuses, nothing more, nothing less.
When you refuse public aid, but ask for financial assistance you are still getting welfare. Oh Maybe not government run, but it is still welfare. Your lack of paying, is what is increasing my insurance premiums. You are taking my money without my permission, just like the public aid assistance increases our tax rates. It is just another tax one you don’t have to pay, but I do. This why hospital bills are so inflated.
Now the argument can be made that it isn’t fair. I am not being rationale because I have never been there, I have good insurance so I don’t understand.HMM a few years ago I finished paying off a $10,000 hospital bill because of lack of insurance. The lack wasn’t really on purpose, we were supposed to have Cobra Coverage but it wasn’t explained and completed correctly. I ended up not only paid for Samantha’s birth, but 7 weeks later, her septic work up, from a seizure status post a breath holding spell that made her stop breathing due to an immature of CNS that didn’t stimulate her to breath, caused her to turn blue and limp, and pretty much dead in my arms. Praise God I just renewed my CPR and it was fresh in my mind. Been there done that I understand.
See you have Faith, you trust in God to care for you. The problem is, you really don’t have faith, God has taken care of you. You just refused what He offered that was healthcare coverage.
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What surgeon would only charge $500 for a surgery? I can’t imagine such a low bill for a case like Jenny. I’d think it would be at least 5x the amount given ($5,000 hospital bill). I’m not sure that 5K is that much to people anymore. Look how much people pay for cars, computers, electronic “toys/gadgets”, etc.
Because of the spacing of the article, I wasn’t sure I followed every sentence, but as I understand it, the author is stating that if you don’t have a job that has health coverage, then find one.
What is : “but 7 weeks later, her septic work up, from a seizure status post a breath holding spell that made her stop breathing due to an immature of CNS that didn’t stimulate her to breath, caused her to turn blue and limp, and pretty much dead in my arms.” What is an “immature of CNS”?
Because of the spacing of the article, I wasn’t sure I followed every sentence, but as I understand it, the author is stating that if you don’t have a job that has health coverage, then find one.
What is : “but 7 weeks later, her septic work up, from a seizure status post a breath holding spell that made her stop breathing due to an immature of CNS that didn’t stimulate her to breath, caused her to turn blue and limp, and pretty much dead in my arms.” What is an “immature of CNS”?
I’m married to a nurse. I sometimes have to interpret e-mails that she writes to our children. She writes the same way she does nursing notes which is short little bursts:) I basically understood what Cathy meant although it was tough and obscured the point somewhat.
Cathy, I agree that people not having coverage raises the cost for all of us but I surely don’t know what the answer is. I am sure that I want the President to be in charge of as little as possible.
Cathy, I agree that people not having coverage raises the cost for all of us but I surely don’t know what the answer is. I am sure that I want the President to be in charge of as little as possible.
[Becky Petersen] What surgeon would only charge $500 for a surgery? I can’t imagine such a low bill for a case like Jenny. I’d think it would be at least 5x the amount given ($5,000 hospital bill). I’m not sure that 5K is that much to people anymore. Look how much people pay for cars, computers, electronic “toys/gadgets”, etc.Not exactly sure what yo are asking, but here goes.
Because of the spacing of the article, I wasn’t sure I followed every sentence, but as I understand it, the author is stating that if you don’t have a job that has health coverage, then find one.
What is : “but 7 weeks later, her septic work up, from a seizure status post a breath holding spell that made her stop breathing due to an immature of CNS that didn’t stimulate her to breath, caused her to turn blue and limp, and pretty much dead in my arms.” What is an “immature of CNS”?
The illustration was just that an illustration. I never said the surgery was $500, I said the surgeons bill was, I am not sure about where you seek medical care, but often doctor’s bill is not included in the hospital bill, thus you get a separate bill.
so your next question, yes, basically, what I am saying is, if a Christian doesn’t have health insurance, then they need to either get it, by getting a job that offer it, or self insure themselves, or pay the entire bill. Asking for a break on a bill is just another form of welfare and is what is driving insurance prices and premiums up.
As for CNS, I assumed a certain knowledge base of my readers, a CNS is central nervous system, thus an immature CNS, would be an immature central nervous sysytem.
As for anything else, I have Rheumatoid arhrititis, swelling and pain (I am in pain now just typing this) in my fingers, my inflammation (CRP) is quite high, thus I am asking for patience and not pointless pondering. Thank you
God is good
Because I worked in the health insurance field for several years, I know the wide disparity between what insurance companies will pay and what some health professionals try to bill individuals for services. In many cases, individuals are taken to the cleaners. I have no problem trying to level that playing field. That is hardly taking advantage of health professionals. It is protecting yourself. I really don’t think that a consumer is necessarily obligated to pay any amount a health professional tries to charge.
For many, Cathy, there are no easy answers. Everyone cannot get a job that offers insurance. In the past ten years, companies are more and more being forced to shift some of the cost to the employee anyway. A person working at McDonalds is probably not going to be able to afford the insurance offered there unless there is additional income from somewhere.
For the past ten years, I have had a high deductible policy (currently $10K). Because that insurance is obviously never really used (except one year when a child had a hospital visit), I negotiate any substantial medical bills. I still probably pay more than the insurance company would, but it helps.
Of course people should pay their bills. But don’t be too intimidated to negotiate with health professionals. In many cases, you will greatly overpay if you don’t.
For many, Cathy, there are no easy answers. Everyone cannot get a job that offers insurance. In the past ten years, companies are more and more being forced to shift some of the cost to the employee anyway. A person working at McDonalds is probably not going to be able to afford the insurance offered there unless there is additional income from somewhere.
For the past ten years, I have had a high deductible policy (currently $10K). Because that insurance is obviously never really used (except one year when a child had a hospital visit), I negotiate any substantial medical bills. I still probably pay more than the insurance company would, but it helps.
Of course people should pay their bills. But don’t be too intimidated to negotiate with health professionals. In many cases, you will greatly overpay if you don’t.
I’ve found that as a cash paying customer, I automatically get a break on medical services, because it saves them the cost of filing claims and waiting for payment. My OB/GYN loves me. :D
Many families have health insurance, but http://www.cnn.com/2009/HEALTH/06/05/bankruptcy.medical.bills/ there are gaps in the coverage that still results in medical debt that leaves them financially strapped.
Many families have health insurance, but http://www.cnn.com/2009/HEALTH/06/05/bankruptcy.medical.bills/ there are gaps in the coverage that still results in medical debt that leaves them financially strapped.
Overall, three-quarters of the people with a medically-related bankruptcy had health insurance, they say.It is a very complicated topic, but I agree that folks should pay their bills and not stiff their creditors.
“That was actually the predominant problem in patients in our study — 78 percent of them had health insurance, but many of them were bankrupted anyway because there were gaps in their coverage like co-payments and deductibles and uncovered services,” says Woolhandler. “Other people had private insurance but got so sick that they lost their job and lost their insurance.”
[CathyM][Becky Petersen]I wasn’t trying to pick at you. I just didn’t understand an “immature of CNS”. I didn’t. My daughter may try to get her CNA and that is all I could think of at the moment. Certified….something .:) I also would have no idea that CRP means inflammation in your fingers. It is an area that I ignorant about. (I’m grateful because it means I don’t have that problem.)
so your next question, yes, basically, what I am saying is, if a Christian doesn’t have health insurance, then they need to either get it, by getting a job that offer it, or self insure themselves, or pay the entire bill. Asking for a break on a bill is just another form of welfare and is what is driving insurance prices and premiums up.
As for CNS, I assumed a certain knowledge base of my readers, a CNS is central nervous system, thus an immature CNS, would be an immature central nervous sysytem.
As for anything else, I have Rheumatoid arhrititis, swelling and pain (I am in pain now just typing this) in my fingers, my inflammation (CRP) is quite high, thus I am asking for patience and not pointless pondering. Thank you
As far as asking for a discount. I disagree. If you pay with cash, you are saving them tremendous amounts of money in time, billing costs, calling costs, etc. (labor). They can pass that on to you without considering that it is “stiffing” the hospital. You should pay your bill. I don’t think it is wrong to ask for a cash discount.
Not everyone can get a job with insurance. Not all companies offer it, and not all people can actually find such a job. Self employed people have a terrible time affording real health insurance.
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