John Piper Announces Leave: "The precious garden of my home needs tending."

[Bob T.] I wonder how many Christians can go to their bosses and ask for a few months off so they can naval gaze to find life flaws and correct them? How many bosses will respond by saying, hey take the time but I want to continue paying you?
All he needs to do is stop writing for awhile and concentrate on preaching only on Sundays at the church and take extra time off for family and personal prayer. No big deal and what all Christians not in salaried ministry positions must do. I have little sympathy for the Pastoral burn out syndrome and special emotional needs due to ministry. The Western culture church Pastor position and ministry is a twisted concept of church leadership and ministry.

I would be for Pastoral sabbaticals if the Pastor would go and get a normal job for that year and live off the wages. The entry or reentry into the real world of work, time, taking orders, and struggle would be a reawakening to many. The most arrogant groups of people (as a group) that I have experienced has been at Pastoral conferences and meetings. Most need to find a lower Pedestal to stand on. When I look at home schooling, Christian schools, Bible College, and Seminary, it is a wonder that those who go right into ministry can tie their own shoe laces.

This statement must be taken in the context of Pipers constant` promotion of English Puritan Calvinism with it’s works oriented salvation, assurance, and self examination sanctification. Many Puritans exhausted themselves seeking to “desire God.”

This is the age of transparency, sensitivity, being in touch, emotional bonding, personal needs, mentoring, and accountability. Naval gazing equals spiritual pursuit to many.

Like the old salty Navy Chief said to me; You tired? OK, then get to work and forget about it.

The pressures and demands of Pastoral ministry overwhelming? McDonald’s is always hiring.

You are using Piper’s marital problems as an excuse to go after someone with whom you disagree with doctrinally. You may have little sympathy for Piper, but fortunately you are not the master that Christians serve, so what is your sympathy worth anyway? If you are going to give or withhold this sympathy to Christians based on such criteria, I would imagine that a lot of Christians would have no use for your sympathy, which is actually not sympathy at all.

“This is the age of transparency, sensitivity, being in touch, emotional bonding, personal needs, mentoring, and accountability. Naval gazing equals spiritual pursuit to many. ” So … English Puritan Calvinists were part of this “naval” gazing age? Explain that one.

“The most arrogant groups of people (as a group) that I have experienced has been at Pastoral conferences and meetings.” Based on your comments here, I wonder if they felt the same about you.

“Many Puritans exhausted themselves seeking to “desire God.”” So did many writers of the Psalms.

“I would be for Pastoral sabbaticals if the Pastor would go and get a normal job for that year and live off the wages.”

Now Piper stated in the link above “I asked the elders not to pay me for this leave.” Were you aware of that when you made your statement? I will give you the benefit of the doubt (although your “How many bosses will respond by saying, hey take the time but I want to continue paying you?” makes it hard) and presume that you were. So, if the purpose of the sabbatical is to spend more time with his wife to work on his marriage, what purpose would taking a “normal job” do other than to divert his time and energy from working on the marriage?

Now I have my own issues with Piper that I will not get into, but his sabbatical statement was far less problematic than your response to it, which reveals yourself to be completely uninterested in whether Piper is making a legitimate attempt to continue to ensure that he meets the Biblical qualification of an elder, and is more motivated by your desire to see someone with whom you doctrinally disagree leave the ministry.

And by the way. I have actually worked at McDonald’s in the past. Have you?

I think a lot of idealistic pressures, like the article on “What Pastors Owe Their Churches” give lip service to putting marriage and children above ministry, but the lip service is just that, token.
If you do what these (many) articles suggest and follow the example of the big-name pastors, in more cases than not, your church ministry is going to be prioritized above your family. Think of all the people we give “strokes” to that have done the above over the years.

Some guys are so oblivious to what makes for good and deeply meaningful relationships that they are unaware how clueless they are — until the wife files for divorce (or the man has an affair because he has not nurtured his own marriage) or the kids communicate how much they resented their workaholic pastor father.

I believe many pastors that we hold up as models have sacrificed their families in the process of becoming successful. For some reason, we preach against being a workaholic but give special exemptions to those in ministry; it is somehow okay for us.

I am not saying Piper did not make efforts to live a balanced life; marriage and family issues can be rough, even if we live a perfectly balanced life. But I have been in the ministry for 31 years now, and I have seen so much nonsense in this area. We want to eat our cakes and have them too.

Hopefully, Piper will head things off at the pass. I have great respect for Piper, but I feel sorry the wives of the big name guys — and their kids.

Like people who “believe” in Jesus for fire insurance but do not want Him in their lives, so many view the pastor as a FUNCTIONARY but not as a person and brother. The hard-driving results crowd needs to…to… to.. stay away from the church I pastor!

[Bob T.] I wonder how many Christians can go to their bosses and ask for a few months off so they can naval gaze to find life flaws and correct them? How many bosses will respond by saying, hey take the time but I want to continue paying you?
All he needs to do is stop writing for awhile and concentrate on preaching only on Sundays at the church and take extra time off for family and personal prayer. No big deal and what all Christians not in salaried ministry positions must do. I have little sympathy for the Pastoral burn out syndrome and special emotional needs due to ministry. The Western culture church Pastor position and ministry is a twisted concept of church leadership and ministry.

I would be for Pastoral sabbaticals if the Pastor would go and get a normal job for that year and live off the wages. The entry or reentry into the real world of work, time, taking orders, and struggle would be a reawakening to many. The most arrogant groups of people (as a group) that I have experienced has been at Pastoral conferences and meetings. Most need to find a lower Pedestal to stand on. When I look at home schooling, Christian schools, Bible College, and Seminary, it is a wonder that those who go right into ministry can tie their own shoe laces.

This statement must be taken in the context of Pipers constant` promotion of English Puritan Calvinism with it’s works oriented salvation, assurance, and self examination sanctification. Many Puritans exhausted themselves seeking to “desire God.”

This is the age of transparency, sensitivity, being in touch, emotional bonding, personal needs, mentoring, and accountability. Naval gazing equals spiritual pursuit to many.

Like the old salty Navy Chief said to me; You tired? OK, then get to work and forget about it.

The pressures and demands of Pastoral ministry overwhelming? McDonald’s is always hiring.

The attitudes expressed in this post reveal a need for some serious navel gazing.

In 30 years, I have never let go of the passion for public productivity. In this leave, I intend to let go of all of it. No book-writing. No sermon preparation or preaching. No blogging. No Twitter. No articles. No reports. No papers. And no speaking engagements. There is one stateside exception—the weekend devoted to the Desiring God National Conference combined with the inaugural convocation of Bethlehem College and Seminary in October. Noël thought I should keep three international commitments. Our reasoning is that if she could go along, and if we plan it right, these could be very special times of refreshment together.

Sounds like he needs to ‘come apart’ before he and his family come apart.

No one has used that pun yet… and it’s a good Baptist pun, ya’ know?

I’ll wager that there are alot of men in the ministry who need to step back or down, but they can’t or won’t because of pride, finances, or the lack of someone who could step in to take their place. It’s one of the reasons I believe mentoring relationships amongst ministers is so important- there should always be someone who is qualified to step in when someone needs to step down.

[Ed Vasicek] I think a lot of idealistic pressures, like the article on “What Pastors Owe Their Churches” give lip service to putting marriage and children above ministry, but the lip service is just that, token.
If you do what these (many) articles suggest and follow the example of the big-name pastors, in more cases than not, your church ministry is going to be prioritized above your family. Think of all the people we give “strokes” to that have done the above over the years.

Some guys are so oblivious to what makes for good and deeply meaningful relationships that they are unaware how clueless they are — until the wife files for divorce (or the man has an affair because he has not nurtured his own marriage) or the kids communicate how much they resented their workaholic pastor father.

I believe many pastors that we hold up as models have sacrificed their families in the process of becoming successful. For some reason, we preach against being a workaholic but give special exemptions to those in ministry; it is somehow okay for us.

I am not saying Piper did not make efforts to live a balanced life; marriage and family issues can be rough, even if we live a perfectly balanced life. But I have been in the ministry for 31 years now, and I have seen so much nonsense in this area. We want to eat our cakes and have them too.

Hopefully, Piper will head things off at the pass. I have great respect for Piper, but I feel sorry the wives of the big name guys — and their kids.

Like people who “believe” in Jesus for fire insurance but do not want Him in their lives, so many view the pastor as a FUNCTIONARY but not as a person and brother. The hard-driving results crowd needs to…to… to.. stay away from the church I pastor!

Charlie Johnson likes this post. He also thinks that a plurality of elders and shared preaching burdens make good sense for the local church, especially large ones.

[handerson]

All he needs to do is stop writing for awhile and concentrate on preaching only on Sundays at the church and take extra time off for family and personal prayer. No big deal and what all Christians not in salaried ministry positions must do.

Let me suggest that the demands of ministry is precisely what keeps pastors from being unable to do what you recommend. One of the primary Biblical expactations of an elder is that he watches for the souls of others and must give account to God for them. (Hebrews 13:17) In this context, it’s often difficult to sufficiently “bear your own burdens” while shouldering the spiritual needs of so many others. This is distinct from the average lay person - yes we bear one anothers spiritual struggles but not to the extent that full-time ministers are expected to. Paul even speaks about this spiritual weight in context of the things that he suffered. (II Cor. 11 - “the care of all the churches.”) More to the point, the very definition of pastoral ministry REQUIRES that you step away if your own spiritual life or family’s is suffering.

You are right that pastoral ministry is not like other jobs.The requirements, expectations, and needs are distinct. And so the Church’s response to pastors who are struggling should be distinct as well.

I have heard too many stories and seen too many claims of so called Pastoral ministry hardships. Nonense! Easiest responsibility I have ever had. Also the most rewarding. The rewards far outweigh the actual sacrifices or hardships. There are some people out there really facing hardships far beyond what most all Pastors suffer. The Pastoral ministry only becomes hard when you take yourself and your being needed beyond what reality really is.

We live in the age of the Pastoral wimp taken in by his own sense of importance.

The Plymouth Brethren have real elders with real jobs and care for the souls of the assembly better than most Institutional clergy churches. There are other groups like them.

We need more home churches and less platformed, big screen, institutional mosoleums,

Some actually did not like my comments? I find that incredible. Why, I expected thunderous applause.

Bob, did you make your comments just to get a reaction out of people, or would you care to address the content of the responses to your post?

“I have heard too many stories and seen too many claims of so called Pastoral ministry hardships. Nonense! Easiest responsibility I have ever had.”

I light of Hebrews 13:17 I don’t see how this can be true. What responsibility is more imporant and demanding then watching out for the souls of people? Then to realize I am going to give an account before the holy infinate God for how handled my responsibility. I think anyone who doesn’t lay awake from time to time burdened over people’s souls and stressing over how to minister to them, doesn’t understand the responsiblity.

[Bob T.] I have heard too many stories and seen too many claims of so called Pastoral ministry hardships. Nonense! Easiest responsibility I have ever had. Also the most rewarding. The rewards far outweigh the actual sacrifices or hardships. There are some people out there really facing hardships far beyond what most all Pastors suffer. The Pastoral ministry only becomes hard when you take yourself and your being needed beyond what reality really is.

We live in the age of the Pastoral wimp taken in by his own sense of importance.

With all due respect, Bob, I don’t see how anyone could describe Pastoral ministry is easy, and I’ve only been a pastor for 7 months. Maybe if the church has a sizable endowment and you don’t actually have to preach the Bible, but I doubt that’s true in your case.

Pastoring is just not the same for everyone. It’s kind of meaningless to generalize about the “unique challenges of being a pastor” etc. for that reason. What you find difficult depends on what you’re good at. And even then, every congregation is different and every ministry setting is different. Some people have relatively easy ministries and find it easy to pass judgment on the difficulties others are having. Some people have relatively easy marriages and find it easy to pass judgment on those who have much more difficulty. In Piper’s case, perhaps you have both a difficult ministry (I can believe that… it’s just big and complex and he’s very personally driven. It only takes a little bit of imagination to see how that could be an overwhelming combination) and a difficult marriage. About the latter, I wouldn’t know about their case, but it’s no reflection on the godliness or maturity of either of them if they find it especially difficult to work together. There are lots of other factors.

I have heard too many stories and seen too many claims of so called Pastoral ministry hardships. Nonense! Easiest responsibility I have ever had. Also the most rewarding. The rewards far outweigh the actual sacrifices or hardships. There are some people out there really facing hardships far beyond what most all Pastors suffer. The Pastoral ministry only becomes hard when you take yourself and your being needed beyond what reality really is.

Wow. We must be from different planets. Being a pastor means possibly being in the leading “burn-out” vocation. How many former pastors do you know? I know tons of ‘em. John Maxwell asserted that he believes one out of ten pastors who begins in the ministry retires in the ministry. Wonder why they have so many retreat centers geared to burnt out pastors? We must be a weakly bunch.

Bob,

I know you are a man of great experience. But you are just wrong on this point. I am 30 yrs younger than you. But I have worked all my life. Since college, I have worked in a few different industries. I have only worked 40 hours a week 1 yr in the past 17. Over those same 17 years I have averaged 60 -70 hours a week. I worked high pressure with sales with high quotas that took long hours. I have worked in dangerous jobs and non dangerous jobs (some manual labor and some not). Nothing has been as difficult or as fun and rewarding as being a pastor of a small church. If you really believe what you said, it may be that you were not very approachable as a pastor. I am not just saying that based on this one statement but many others that you have said here I think your statement has more to do with your bias against Piper than anything else. I doubt your attidute would be the same if we were speaking of the late Zane Hodges.

BTW, like Larry, I don’t consider myself a Piper apologist. If Jack Schaap were doing this same thing my attitude would be the same. I would be praying that the Lord would use this in these men’s lives to grow them where they need growth.

I hope this post does not come across mean or in anger because that is not my intent. I pray for you often Bob and have respect for you. Although, I am disappointed by your callousness and arrogance shown today.

While I mentioned in a previous post that most pastors have to deal with personal issues while remaining in ministry, mainly due to finances, I support a sabbatical (for whatever reason a pastor may feel the need to take it) for the following 2 reasons:

1. After 30 years of ministry (like Piper has completed) most pastors have probably taken no more than 2 weeks off at a time for rest or vacation. I minister in a rural area; after 11 years, most men in my church have had layoffs of at least a couple of months. In this time they draw unemployment and can rest or do things at their home. Pastors rarely get this kind of break, and after 30 years I hardly think 8 months is unreasonable.

2. When a church has grown significantly like Piper’s has, and given he may have 5 years left, such a time could be edifying to the church. Many people are there because he is there, and, in my opinion, such a time like this might help the church become less Piper-focused.

Don’t know much about naval gazing…but I would highly recommend heart searching! In fact, I would say that one of main reasons there is pastoral burn-out is because we don’t do that enough. Getting apart from the ministry and asking God to reveal my heart…to search my heart…to try my heart…to show me what I love more than Him is crucial to ministry vitality.

Because if I’m doing this for any other reason than HIS glory…because I love HIM…than it’s going to wear me down. For example, if I’m pastoring seeking the approval of men, I’m running a frivolous, exhausting, and rewardless race. . Or if I’m ministering for MY name instead of HIS name…I’m bound for either great disappointment or incredible arrogance.

The problem is these heart desires are subtle. My heart is deceitful and wicked and I may not even SEE these desires are driving me. I need to get alone with God and cry out to Him to reveal these to me, no matter how ugly they are! IMO, our pastor conferences are filled with arrogance because we don’t get away and “naval gaze” enough. Men are trashing their marriages because they’ve forgotten Eph. 5:25 and don’t take the time to ask “How am I loving her?” And way too many of us are doing this for applause and approval of men but never stop long enough to see it ourselves. Yeah…my naval is pretty clean…but my heart is far from clean. I NEED to take time to heart gaze.

Besides…or Savior often came away from ministry to alone with the Father. If He needed it, you can bet WE do!