Total Depravity: The Man Who Killed a Guy In Church Because He Sat in His Pew

….the original link does not say the accused was the “possessor” of that pew. By the full account, I’m guessing he was a visitor who was not terribly interested in the Gospel message, to put it mildly.

Not the point, but I have to say it because so much confusion persists about the term. “Total depravity” does not mean “sinfulness at its worst”… so some other term would better describe the situation.

HSBC in her founding documents states that pew rents would never be charged.

Am I the only one who has seen a visitor take a seat in a pew where “Mr. and Mrs. Long time church members” have sat for 30 years and had this couple stand there and stare at the visitor until they moved, sometimes even saying, “That’s our place.”

I’ve visited a church where, as I began to take a seat (by all appearances available) in an unoccupied pew, I was rather sternly told by someone standing nearby, “That’s saved!”

This is a hard situation, but it’s worth noting that PA does allow carry in churches, but also has a duty to retreat if practical. It’s also worth noting that showing of your carry permit is one small step away from brandishing your weapon, which is a felony in most states. Bad move, and “wannabe cop” is an appropriate description of this.

I won’t say that permit holders ought not carry in churches as Joe does, but it is clear to me that the permit holder violated PA law and common good sense tactics; he missed the point during his carry permit class. It also is clear that churches need to train ushers in how to deal with a disruption. If we’re doing things right, we ARE going to get druggies in the pews who desperately are seeking a way out.

One final note; pew rentals ended what, 150 years ago? Apart from special music and such, isn’t it time to end reserved pews? Wouldn’t that be something we’d infer from James 2—that we ought not show certain members special preference without a very good reason?

(one exception I’d carve out would be spots for the handicapped—we’ve got a paraplegic at our church, and we all make room in the row that has two less chairs so he’s got a place)

[Ron Bean]

Am I the only one who has seen a visitor take a seat in a pew where “Mr. and Mrs. Long time church members” have sat for 30 years and had this couple stand there and stare at the visitor until they moved, sometimes even saying, “That’s our place.”

Visiting a church for the first time almost 20 years ago, when an elderly gentleman coming down the aisle turned to his wife and said “they’re sitting in our pew.” She hustled him off to another pew.