Bob Jones University Enters a New Era

I had a great four years at BJU—GREAT! Keep in mind that though there were strict rules, these aren’t so unlike life if you think about it (I’m now emphasizing the practical life training from rules, not unlike the military). Okay, so you finish four years at BJU and get married and buy a house. Guess what? The rules don’t stop just because you left Greenville. You better get that license plate renewal on time, or you’re busted. You forgot to pay your property taxes? You’re busted again. You parked the wrong direction on your street; now you got a ticket and will have to pay a fee. Does parking on the wrong side of the road seem like a petty infraction? It does, but that’s life, my friend. You’re late for your dental appointment? The receptionist may not be as friendly as she was last time, and you have a testimony to uphold, right? Why not look at the rules as a means of training folks for life instead of putting a negative spin on them? I’m truly saddened by those who had a rough time at BJU, but I didn’t personally know folks in those shoes when I was there.

About the “Nazis” who had to enforce the rules…Nazis, really? I suppose this term was used in jest, but I don’t personally believe that term should ever be used to describe other believers. Who were these Bo Jos? They were nice guys just like you and me; they also had heavy course loads and needed help paying their tuition, and they had pressures just like the rest of us. They were offered a job as Hall Leader or Dorm Supervisor or some other title. That meant yes, they needed to keep an eye open for rule infractions and make sure everybody was in bed after lights out, but I know for a fact that many of them also met face-to-face with guys and inquired into their spiritual growth. And if somebody was consistently breaking rules, they met with him too. I know one Dorm Sup who met with me (I still know him, and he’s pastoring today); he asked some probing questions and really seemed to care about where I was with the Lord. And then because the guys met every night at 10:30 for dorm prayer meeting, we got to know these guys through sharing and prayer. They weren’t mean guys (not the ones I knew), but they had a job they were employed to do. They didn’t like giving somebody demerits for not taking out the trash, but that’s what they were required to do. Either that or lose the job. But don’t buy that there wasn’t often real discipleship going on, because it was. I saw it happen. Was the place perfect? Of course not. It was populated by sinners. Were some rule watchers overly stern or picky? Maybe, though I didn’t experience that.
About the rules…nope, no pink and blue sidewalks. Seriously, most of my friends and I were too busy with our credit loads and trying to get big papers done while fitting in a ministry extension on the weekend to worry too much about the rules. Just do ‘em and avoid one more thing on your back. No biggie. As others have said, there are sidewalks everywhere; there’s absolutely no reason to ever have to walk on the grass. (One exception was Bible Conference: You could have a picnic with friends on the grass with a big blanket and lots of yummy snacks. Great times and terrific photos I enjoy looking at today.)

I just hate to see daily life at BJU (for me in the late 1980s and early 1990s) so mischaracterized. It was a wonderful place, and I’ll never forget it. It wasn’t a perfect place, but my experience was terrific. I’m not against needed change. For example, nobody in the 1980s had a cell phone, so now I suppose you need a rule about turning ringers off during chapel. But I’m just not sure that letting skirts slip up the knee or allowing women to wear tight blue jeans is a needed change. Perhaps others here can explain why changes like those are so NEEDED. Due to new laundry detergent, skin will break out in hives if the material is too loose? Or knees will get blisters if they are covered?

One experience today’s students no longer benefit from are the daily family-style dinners. I didn’t *like* having to wear a jacket and tie to dinner every day, or having to meet new people every rotation, but I am really glad that was part of my training. I still remember one year when a new freshman came to dinner for the first time and took his coat off and placed it on the back of his chair. I told him that he would probably need to put his jacket back on. I still remember his reply – “they won’t care as long as I have it with me…” I said with a smile, “No, I think they are going to care….” Sure enough, someone came by and forced him to put it back on. Good times. My Dad met my Mom at one of those family-style meals. He was the host and she was the hostess. He loves telling that story. None of this is sin issue; it’s just the type of thing that made BJU special back in the day.

Adam, I appreciate your comments. One thing you wrote, above, captures the differences in our philosophies:

Why not look at the rules as a means of training folks for life instead of putting a negative spin on them?

Here is the difference - I’ve never looked at University as a place where I’m “trained for life.” Also, my own context makes me want to laugh at the idea that a 19 year old has to be “trained for life.” I see the University as a place where you’re trained for a vocation while you’re already living your life!

• I was running a military police shift at 19, and I’m not an unusual person!
• Fleet Marine Force Corpsmen are forward deployed right now ​saving lives at 19 years old.
• 19-yr old MM3’s are out there in the fleet right now, ​standing watch in the engine rooms of Navy cruisers, destroyers and carriers.

I cannot even fathom the kind of mindset that views 18-22 year olds as children who still need to be “trained for life.” Please try to understand my context, and the context of millions of other Christians who don’t come from Baptist fundamentalism. It is truly weird to me to even have to argue for this perspective!

I view University as an institution that provides a product for a fee. Others view it as a finishing school, of sorts.. There is a world of difference between these perspectives. We see it on this thread. What I see so far in the defense of “old-school” BJU is nostalgia, not an actual argument. I hope Don (or somebody else) can put some substance on the argument. Go BJU.

You say, “Go BJU,” but what you are disagreeing with is exactly what BJU still is. The place is still all about training them for life. That hasn’t changed. So while I understand your unusual perspective (no, I don’t know any nineteen-year-olds with the responsibilities you had—good for you!), your response of “Go BJU” is a little puzzling. They’ve just been incrementally changing rules and shifting the focus a bit, which is what began this discussion.

I don’t believe I even used the term “trained for life” (I searched), but if you want to see it that way, I won’t argue. Sure, BJU is about further spiritual and educational training for life, just like church and further education (it’s all about continuing development, no?). But as others here have echoed, I don’t personally see most eighteen-year-olds or nineteen-year-olds as ready for life without further help on the path of maturity (you would be an unusual exception). But you are welcome to disagree with anything I’ve stated here. I appreciate your unique perspective.

GN Barkman, totally aside from the conversation - was your father on the business factulty in the 70’s? Mr. Barkman was a good professor and I utilize some of his teaching every day in my job running a bank.

Yes, my father, Beryl Barkman taught at BJU in the School of Business from around 1970 or ‘71 to about 1983. He then went to the University of South Carolina to obtain a PhD in accounting, and taught for 15 years at the University of Massachusetts, North Dartmouth campus. He went on BJU faculty after I finished my BA and was married, so I was unable to receive any discounts available to faculty children when I enrolled in graduate school. My father was a natural teacher, and a truly godly man. He really cared about his students, and would be pleased to hear your comments. He died in 2012 at the age of 95. He is greatly missed. Thanks for asking.

My quote was from your post, above mine. Here is the context, from your first paragraph:

Does parking on the wrong side of the road seem like a petty infraction? It does, but that’s life, my friend. You’re late for your dental appointment? The receptionist may not be as friendly as she was last time, and you have a testimony to uphold, right? Why not look at the rules as a means of training folks for life instead of putting a negative spin on them? I’m truly saddened by those who had a rough time at BJU, but I didn’t personally know folks in those shoes when I was there.

I don’t think I’m unique. There are thousands of young Christian men and women serving in the military, who have similar positions of responsibility right now. It wasn’t hyperbole when I spoke about the MM3, or the FMF Corpsman. They’re out there. I promise! I’m not a unique person. Honestly, the kind of atmosphere you’re describing at a fundamentalist Christian university is the real unique experience, when you weigh it proportionally to the millions of Christian men and women in the world, today. Of course, it isn’t just the military. Many, many Christian men and women do just fine without the kind of loco parentis atmosphere many Christian universities have adopted. This is one reason why I applaud the advent of online and virtual education; that, and the lower cost!

“Go BJU” means I applaud their saner approach to Christian life at the University. I generally disagree with the loco parentis approach across the board. I do realize, however, that it’s easier for me to say this, because I’m not the President of a University! I had a brief conversation with Marty Marriot years ago, where he told me that I’m not like most people, and that many Christians need this kind of atmosphere at university. I appreciate the perspective. I get it. But, I do applaud BJU’s change in method, which was the point of the article.

[TylerR] I don’t think I’m unique. There are thousands of young Christian men and women serving in the military, who have similar positions of responsibility right now. It wasn’t hyperbole when I spoke about the MM3, or the FMF Corpsman. They’re out there. I promise! I’m not a unique person. Honestly, the kind of atmosphere you’re describing at a fundamentalist Christian university is the real unique experience, when you weigh it proportionally to the millions of Christian men and women in the world, today.

Much of the difference is in the expectations placed upon the young adult man or woman. Schools like BJU and PCC believe 18-22 year old students still need parental oversight and cannot be trusted. Thus, they both expect their students to act like children and they treat them as such. On the other hand, the military expects their 18-22 year old recruits to be disciplined men and women (at least on duty) who are willing to fight and die for their country.

Thus, the rules at BJU/PCC are put in place to produce a different result than the rules in the military. BJU/PCC rules seek to produce conformity to cultural fundamentalism. Military rules seek to produce trained soldiers who will kill and die on command.

Sure, sometimes we have somewhat arbitrary rules that we have to follow, but sometimes we also ought to say “you have got to be kidding me” to a lot of these regulations. I have no objection to rules that have a plausible explanation for them, but I think it’s dangerous to condition people to obey arbitrary rules simply because people in authority say that’s the way it is. I think it’s also dangerous—see some earlier comments—to condition people to not question those rules. Fundamentalism has been burned way too many times by unquestioning submission to arbitrary authority.

I like the idea of family style dinners, though. The military academies do about the same thing for a lot of the same reasons.

[G. N. Barkman]

Yes, my father, Beryl Barkman taught at BJU in the School of Business from around 1970 or ‘71 to about 1983. He then went to the University of South Carolina to obtain a PhD in accounting, and taught for 15 years at the University of Massachusetts, North Dartmouth campus. He went on BJU faculty after I finished my BA and was married, so I was unable to receive any discounts available to faculty children when I enrolled in graduate school. My father was a natural teacher, and a truly godly man. He really cared about his students, and would be pleased to hear your comments. He died in 2012 at the age of 95. He is greatly missed. Thanks for asking.

Well, there’s a connection I never made. Your dad was my advisor my first semester at BJU, when I was a clueless freshman. I started as a business major, but got under the burden of the ministry mid-way through that first semester and switched to Bible my second semester. Really appreciated your dad.

[TylerR]

I took my anecdote about the grass from a conversation between you and Steve Davis. It is true I know nothing about “the grass,” but I gathered from this thread that (1) the grass exists, (2) people occasionally walk on it, and (3) they get demerits for doing so. Therefore, I felt comfy drawing a parallel between (1) worrying about overzealous demerit police vs. (2) being treated like an adult in the military. The point of the parallel is to show that I believe the “University as surrogate parent” approach is less than ideal.

Like I said, you don’t know what you are talking about. The other fellows have already chimed in about their experience, which matches mine. You are making huge assumptions about en loco parentis as well. This used to be the default view of all universities, not just BJU or other Christian colleges. Dr. Bob Sr meant to build an institution that taught young people how to live, not just how to make a living. Maybe you don’t value that, but I think it is extremely important. This generation needs it more than previous generations did.

As to walking on the grass… it is hard enough to get grass to grow in the red clay the University is built on. They made it clear that we weren’t to walk on the grass and provided many sidewalks to get where we needed to go. I suspect the fellow Steve chased down was “known” as a troublemaker for other reasons and Steve was determined not to let him get away with it. I can well believe that of Steve as he was in those years. As I said in my comment to him, I always thought of him as tough but fair. I never had a problem with Steve (other than his society, but that’s a different story…).

You say the military treats people like adults. That isn’t my observation. I have a second job at a military base. Everyone is under scrutiny by the higher authorities, written accountability for duties is expected, nothing that is expected is left to random chance or the impulses of the individual. It is the least “treating like adults” organization I’ve ever seen.

[TylerR]

As I said, there are lots of different concepts of the role of the University swirling about in this thread. Here are two questions that may move the discussion forward:

• Is it just the rule changes you object to at BJU?
• Why do you believe adults need these rules at 18, but not 22, in order to live healthy Christian lives?

No, it isn’t just the rule changes I object to. There are a whole host of changes that bother me. The intercollegiate sports program is one. They are training followers instead of leaders with this move, not to mention the attempt to imitate the big name universities and their “rah, rah team” mentality. There are other changes as well, I’m not going to get into a list here.

I think we all need rules all our lives long. But it isn’t just the rules. You are fixated on that part of the question, but it is a whole philosophy of life that I am interested in. BJU still does do many good things, still instills discipline, and so on. It is just that, to me, they aren’t what they once were and are headed in the wrong direction, in my opinion.

Don wrote:

Dr. Bob Sr meant to build an institution that taught young people how to live, not just how to make a living. Maybe you don’t value that, but I think it is extremely important. This generation needs it more than previous generations did.

Once again, here is the philosophical divide. I don’t think that is the university’s role. It is the family’s role, with the help of the local church. I understand you disagree. But, this fundamental (pun intended) disagreement in philosophy is the dividing line in the spectrum of opinions on this thread. This is what the entire disagreement on this thread comes down to - what is the university’s role in the life of an 18-22 year old? I think this is a good discussion to have. I just wish we had more information on your objection. Here is my list of reasons you’ve provided:

• BJU has changed intercollegiate sports. How so, and why does it matter?
• BJU’s “philosophy of life” has changed. How, and why does it matter?

You are clearly passionate about the “old paths” BJU used to take. Tell me why? For what reasons? I’m not trying to be rude, I honestly want to know. What I hear so far is sentimentalism. I don’t hear arguments. I heard the same thing from old-timers in the Navy who complained that “things ain’t like they used to be!” When I pressed them for examples, they couldn’t ever provide much. The closest I ever came was when MAC Trammell told me, “When I was younger, you had to personally save the CO from the deck of a burning ship to get a NAM (Navy Achievement Medal). Now, they give ‘em out like candy!” I never got anything more substantive than that. I see amazing parallels here, in our discussion.

[TylerR]

Don wrote:

Dr. Bob Sr meant to build an institution that taught young people how to live, not just how to make a living. Maybe you don’t value that, but I think it is extremely important. This generation needs it more than previous generations did.

Once again, here is the philosophical divide. I don’t think that is the university’s role. It is the family’s role, with the help of the local church. I understand you disagree.

Dr Bob Sr taught young people how to live based on norms of southern, cultural fundamentalism … not Scripture. Let’s be clear and honest about this. So, Don apparently values southern, cultural fundamentalism and finds it “extremely important.”

What!? And on what basis do you make that statement? Of course the philosophy of BJU, even back then, was based on scripture. It always has been. Applications may change over time, but the foundational philosophy has always been grounded in scripture.

Off the cuff, I can think of the prohibition of interracial dating, as well as Bob Sr.’s support for segregation. No?

In addition, a large portion of the student handbook amounts to a modernized version of Southern gentility minus the mint juleps, really. There are portions there that I think are really good ideas—it’s a good thing to get a young person used to wearing a shirt with a collar and a tie, for example, especially if he’s going into one of the professions. Same thing for a young lady getting used to wearing a skirt and blouse. I also think it can be a good thing to get kids to come out of listening only to a very narrow range of popular music. I just don’t think it’s required by Scripture, and they hurt their cause by presenting things as such.

Being the dad of high school age kids, and having participated in ministries for kids of that age, I can say emphatically that a lot of kids need a bit of help in this area. It’s a consequence of the fact that about half of kids will, by the time they turn 18, live in a household without one or both of their parents. So no objection to presenting opportunities/requirements to act like a grownup at all; just a huge objection to pretending it’s all an inevitable requirement of Scripture.