How Long Will Your Church Survive Under a Clinton Presidency?

The church will survive no matter who is President, Prime Minister, or Caesar. There is a King over all other kings, and no election will change that. He will build his church and the gates of Hades will not overpower it (and neither will the gates of the White House).

An important question to consider is how the decision about whether to vote for Trump is affecting churches. So many Christians are so determined to keep Clinton from becoming President that they are insisting that Christians MUST vote and vote for Trump. They view those Christians who are not as quick to decide as lacking common sense and obviously deficient in spirituality. The decision about Trump is splitting churches, families, and personal relationships. This is bizarre. I only recently decided to vote for Trump after a long time of working through this. Some in my church are not happy with my taking so long, and 2 families have decided not to attend any longer. They refuse to even meet to discuss it. So hypocritical.

Some in my church are not happy with my taking so long, and 2 families have decided not to attend any longer. They refuse to even meet to discuss it. So hypocritical.

How in the world would they know who you are voting for or how long it took you to figure it out?

Many families in our church have struggled with and are struggling with their vote this election. Women whose husbands have cheated on them, women who were sexually abused, adults whose father had affairs when those adults were children, to name a few. Trump’s vulgarity, sexual bragging, etc make this decision a mater of conscience for some of them, and it’s difficult. I did a Sunday night series this Fall called “Making Choices In A Confusing World” in order to help people with this election, and I mentioned my own hesitation about Trump, so people know that I have not been quick to jump on the Trump bandwagon. Apparently, because I did not make a quick decision, a decision which was so obvious to them, they are not happy.

It seems to me that would be a great reminder to remember the mission of the church and the role of the pastor. Preach the word and stay out of politics. It divides people over things that aren’t the gospel. Teach people to think and apply the Scripture and let them use it. I don’t think pastors should be involved in these things publicly. We have a higher mission. I would hate to lose the opportunity to minister to people because I took a stand on something that wasn’t part of the Christian faith.

that in San Francisco we shouldn’t take a stand against the LGBT agenda and those who support it?

I can easily see us not being able to gather for services in our meeting house. But, the congregation will survive and may even increase.

I did not “take a stand” on political issues. People in our church were openly struggling with how to vote, if to vote at all. I addressed these concerns in general ways by doing exactly what was suggested: Teach Biblical Principles About Making Decisions. In the process I mentioned that both candidates had major problems. Trump supporters (or should I more accurately say Clinton-haters?) did not like that. How ironic that this historic election will bring significant change to America, one way or the other, and Christians are more divided than ever. When Christ returns, what kind of church will He find?

Are you saying that in San Francisco we shouldn’t take a stand against the LGBT agenda and those who support it?

That’s a moral issue, not a political one. That is something that arises from Scripture.

In the process I mentioned that both candidates had major problems. Trump supporters (or should I more accurately say Clinton-haters?) did not like that.

But you told them who you were voting, didn’t you? Or did I misunderstand?

No, never said from the pulpit who I was or was not voting for. That information came out when people asked me questions later. When they asked questions, I said that I wasn’t sure I could vote for Trump and that this may be the first Presidential election that I do not vote for a Presidential candidate. I have since decided to press the button by Trump’s name. When I do so on Nov 8, I will hold my nose and take nausea medicine.

political as the political establishment backs the LGBT agenda. The question becomes how do you deal with moral issues the take on political ramifications.

[Larry]

Are you saying that in San Francisco we shouldn’t take a stand against the LGBT agenda and those who support it?

That’s a moral issue, not a political one. That is something that arises from Scripture.

I’ve been up-front with people that I can’t support one (Trump) and I won’t support the other (Clinton).

As for the church - I’m not concerned. People either love the Lord and will follow him, or they will leave the church for whatever reasons. All I can do is minister to whoever continues to come and follow Him.

I’m not sure he understands his analogy mathematically.

859. There is a pleasure in being in a ship beaten about by a storm, when we are sure that it will not founder. The persecutions which harass the Church are of this nature.

- B. Pascal

Jay, when you say, “I cannot support Trump,” I’m wondering what you mean. Trump has made some very lascivious statements that I can’t support. Especially in the past. But I’m not sure I expect moral purity from a president. I tend to see him as very open about who he is. (Or was?) But I fully expect that many of our elected officials have the same evils in their hearts.

The difference is that they are politicians - so they hid it better. And they have been politicians for a long time. So they have hidden it for a long time. Career politics is part of what I think is hurting our country. I want to see political outsiders take office. I don’t see how to do that without some nose holding that other politicians spare us with obfuscation.