More on Ferguson and White Privilege

We are all disprivileged:

• All dead spiritually
• All marching towards physical death. Just a matter of time … we all have our threescore and ten more or less
• Money won’t help
• Education won’t save us

Joel’s comment suggests to me that we could have a productive discussion about what kinds of help churches could give to places like Ferguson, North Minneapolis, or for that matter the poorer neighborhoods in our own towns. I’ve had the opportunity over the past six years to minister to a lot of kids from poorer families in small towns (the trailer park residents, families who live in the run down homes, etc..), and while thankfully crime has not been involved, a lot of the other things that afflict minorities in the inner city are there. Single parenthood, drugs and alcohol, and in the kids you see a really bad time in school, have never learned to work, and the like.

Really a lot of the same stuff I saw in Compton, Dallas, and Phoenix. (which is part of why I’m skeptical of claims of “white privilege”, really….the skin hues change, but the story is about the same) My approach so far is to help the kids see the benefits of doing things God’s way and respect the rules of society in doing so (like Joel said, hands out of your pockets, look someone in the eyes, smile), but boy, it’s hard.

5 disturbing stats on black-white inequality

Doesn’t answer the “why?”

I honestly can’t believe half the stuff that’s been written on here. And we wonder why Fundamentalism is white and can’t seem to diversify? and that it’s shrinking? *SHOCKED*

And, Jim Welch, your request to use biblical language to describe human conduct and attitudes is a distraction. What about words like: crime, mental illness, depression, ADHD, ADD, obesity, etc… you see my point?

Fellas, do some study on sociological issues like white privilege. Oh wait, “sociology” isn’t a biblical category..

Gentlemen, Fundamentalism is dead. Who’s the next generation that’s going to uphold your shallow views? Good thing you all have Steve Anderson..

Yes, I’m mad and frustrated. Good night.

Since you wrote “half” and not “all,” it’s pretty hard to determine how to respond.

I will say that if the views that are common in the next generation include the fact that common decency doesn’t need to be observed or shared by those “not in privilege” and that criminal acts or rush to judgment are acceptable responses to “injustice” from those not privileged, then I will be quite happy to be thought out of touch with the new generation’s reality.

Who is saying that common decency doesn’t need to be observed or shared by those “not in privilege”? Who says that criminal acts or rush to judgment are acceptable responses? I can believe that there is a white privilege that is present within this country as well as also believe that there needs to be justice for shop owners that were looted or due process for officer Wilson. We don’t have to set up a false dilemma argument here.

I agree that there are some who are protesting have definitely rushed to judge Officer Wilson. However there are also many protesters that felt that certain facts were being with held about the case such as the autopsy. Or that the police were being quite selective in what they released.

And If you’d like, I could keep on going with example after example of White privilege that I’ve seen because I’ve lived in community with those who are African-American for over half of my life. I’ve seen a side that most fundamentalist white Christians haven’t seen unless your closest friends are black and have been your neighbors for around 25 years.

I appreciate Bert’s focus on what kind of help can the church provide communities like Ferguson. However, the cynical side of me agrees with iKuyper (although I would have said it more graciously). Don’t know if it is possible because I believe the majority of fundamentalists are quite weak in their theology of social ethics or haven’t developed any deep relationships with other black Christians. At the same time, when I’ve interacted with some on sharper iron, I’ve also had enough fruitful interactions where people are listening to each other even when they disagree. And that gives me hope.

By the way, if you’d like to see a gospel-centered response to what is happening in Ferguson and St. Louis, check out D.A. Horton’s blog. He is a former bible professor and now a church planter with the SBC. http://www.dahorton.com/3-thoughts-1-plan/

I know the thread has kind of died out, but I thought this was apropos. It is somewhat tangential, focused on millennials, but it covers much of the same ground for much of the same reasons. Some excerpts:

Ninety eight percent of the businesses, inventions, and great ideas that made America a cultural, economic, and military superpower came from old dead white guys of the sort who are sneered at on college campuses as bigoted, awful relics of bygone eras. That’s ironic if you think about it because without those men the colleges where they’re being sneered at wouldn’t exist.

Hollywood, academia, and popular culture champion a world where snark has replaced wisdom, marriage isn’t considered a lifetime commitment, where there’s spirituality without God, where it’s better to be silent than to risk offending someone, where people don’t understand that everything is a trade-off, and where the more happy, successful and well-adjusted you are, the more likely it must be that you screwed someone else over to get that way.

Here is another excellent, balanced article on the racial question in America written by an African American.

Though racial discrimination exists, it is nowhere near the barrier it once was. The relevant question is: How much of what we see today can be explained by racial discrimination? This is an important question because if we conclude that racial discrimination is the major cause of black problems when it isn’t, then effective solutions will be elusive forever. To begin to get a handle on the answer, let’s pull up a few historical facts about black Americans.

It’s worth noting that, per Chip’s comment, why did the overt racism hurt Walter Williams, Thomas Sowell, and thousands of other blacks far less than the Great Society? One interesting thing that Williams and Sowell have also found is that once you control for the marital status of parents, various sociological differences races and ethnicities largely disappear—and since about 1950, unwed parenting among blacks has risen from about 18% to about 70%. If unwed parenting is indeed a hazard to kids—and it is—you will quickly figure out that this is a recipe for disaster.

To draw a picture appropriate to the Ferguson tragedies, some of the evidence coming out may indicate that the deceased picked a fight with a storekeeper that he won, and then proceeded to pick a fight with a police officer that he lost. If this is true, then it would appear that Mr. Brown never learned that if you are 292 lbs. and strong as a bull, using your size to bully others will eventually get you on the wrong end of a gun or other lethal weapon.

Now the question; if indeed Mr. Brown was never told this, is it “white privilege” that prevented his father and mother from discussing this fact of life with him, or was it the fact that his father and mother were not married, and hence his father never got the chance to see a pattern of bullying developing, and thus never got the chance to rebuke him? I’m leaning towards the latter, and it would appear that one huge key to resolving problems in all poor areas (and not just those where the residents are black or brown-skinned) is to somehow re-incentivize marriage.

Bert,

Dealing with the real issue to get real results is exactly the point of the second article. You nailed it.

I agree that the broken family, especially the lack of fathers has decimated the black community in America. The organization I oversee, Urban Transformation Ministries (UTM), addresses fatherlessness through its programs and mentoring relationships. We intentionally disciple young urban men (most of whom are black) into Christian leaders that are now reaching back into their neighborhood with the gospel. If you are interested in how to do ministry in places like Ferguson, check out our web site. http://www.utmgr.org. Also, here is a promotional video that we made about our Man-Up program. http://vimeo.com/97889386

However, here is where I disagree with you Bert. The examples of white privilege that I shared earlier had nothing to do with whether they came from a single parent family or a married family, but rather with the color of their skin. Let me share another story with you. We also have a few white students that are part of our programs. One of them shared that he and his brothers used to regularly shoplift at the largest mall in the Grand Rapids area because they knew that its security were usually following the black students around. They shop lifted at least 25 times without getting caught. Because its security guards had profiled black students as their main targets for shop lifting, he and his brothers used their white privilege for evil. Again, I have so many stories from the 20 years of being an urban missionary of the fact that white privilege is not a myth. I can keep on going if you’d like……

Here is where I believe one of the problems lies. Certain African-American leaders such as Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson have made racial discrimination as the only reason why there is inequality between blacks and whites. It has become their Maslows hammer (if all you have is a hammer in your toolbox, then every problem looks like a nail). The media has also contributed to this false narrative. Unfortunately, they have sabotaged their own cause by claiming that just about everything is caused by racial discrimination, which makes it harder to take their words seriously. Thus If everything is caused by racism, then nothing is caused by racism, which is why I believe that many on this thread have a difficult time believing that racial discrimination is still a problem in America.

Yet there is still a problem with racism in this country. It may not look like the Jim Crow of a couple generations ago, as it is more passive. That is why the phrase white privilege has emerged.

Joel, agreed on the horrendous damage that Sharpton and Jackson have done by assuming everything is racism—not to mention reckless accusations like the Tawana Brawley case. Somehow I don’t imagine that, had he lived, Dr. King would have gone for that or tolerated that. As one guy who led me to Christ noted, it’s been said that Dr. King told Jackson something along the lines of “Jesse, you have no love.”

And I don’t deny that some of the problem is racism. I just think that, as I observe things, other factors are much bigger, especially in terms of the consistent complaint about loss prevention following people. To use loss prevention as a picture again, William D. may well be correct that many blacks see it as a form of racism to discourage hoodies and loose pants; shopkeepers, on the other hand, view hoodies and super-loose pants as a great place to put stolen goods. So is the preponderance of loss prevention efforts directed at blacks, or is it directed at young men wearing loose pants and hoodies?

​I view it as mostly the latter with a bit of the former, and am reminded of times when my dad encouraged me to look like I was interested in buying something when I went into a store. And when I’ve ignored that advice, wearing ratty jeans and t-shirts to Macy’s or something like that, I do get profiled as someone who isn’t interested in buying their level of merchandise.

Joel thank you for your insight. You wrote:

I agree that the broken family, especially the lack of fathers has decimated the black community in America. The organization I oversee, Urban Transformation Ministries (UTM), addresses fatherlessness through its programs and mentoring relationships. We intentionally disciple young urban men (most of whom are black) into Christian leaders that are now reaching back into their neighborhood with the gospel. If you are interested in how to do ministry in places like Ferguson, check out our web site. http://www.utmgr.org (link is external). Also, here is a promotional video that we made about our Man-Up program. http://vimeo.com/97889386 (link is external)

However, here is where I disagree with you Bert. The examples of white privilege that I shared earlier had nothing to do with whether they came from a single parent family or a married family, but rather with the color of their skin. Let me share another story with you. We also have a few white students that are part of our programs. One of them shared that he and his brothers used to regularly shoplift at the largest mall in the Grand Rapids area because they knew that its security were usually following the black students around. They shop lifted at least 25 times without getting caught. Because its security guards had profiled black students as their main targets for shop lifting, he and his brothers used their white privilege for evil. Again, I have so many stories from the 20 years of being an urban missionary of the fact that white privilege is not a myth. I can keep on going if you’d like……

Here is where I believe one of the problems lies. Certain African-American leaders such as Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson have made racial discrimination as the only reason why there is inequality between blacks and whites. It has become their Maslows hammer (if all you have is a hammer in your toolbox, then every problem looks like a nail). The media has also contributed to this false narrative. Unfortunately, they have sabotaged their own cause by claiming that just about everything is caused by racial discrimination, which makes it harder to take their words seriously. Thus If everything is caused by racism, then nothing is caused by racism, which is why I believe that many on this thread have a difficult time believing that racial discrimination is still a problem in America.

Yet there is still a problem with racism in this country. It may not look like the Jim Crow of a couple generations ago, as it is more passive. That is why the phrase white privilege has emerged.

I have lived in Midwest farming communities all my life and have not had contact with many people of either color from the inner cities. In fact, I chuckle when I think of the time I was “profiled” in the Twin Cites. I was using my pickup truck to help a friend move some stuff up to the Cities when he got a call that his father in law was in the hospital, so we stopped at the hospital in the middle of the metro area to see him. I got on the elevator and and a guy with strange colored spiked hair, leather, etc. got on as well. No one seemed to notice him, but they were staring at me- I was wearing a seed corn cap, cowboy boots, and had a huge pliers on my belt.

I know of one black family that lives in our town (yes we are in the white midwest where we seldom even come in contact with black individuals unless we go to a town of over 10,000 people). I know the husband of the family here in town and he is a fellow believer and one of the nicest guys you could meet, so it is easy to forget about the color of his skin and the fact that he may be facing some issues that I do not face. I think for someone like me, there is somewhat of a racial disconnect because I see this family and there is no reason for me to feel uncomfortable around them, so I can easily miss what is happening across a broader spectrum or that others may not look at them the same way I do. I do not feel at all nervous around them, but I want to check my door locks when I see the white kid from the apartment complex bouncing as he walks with his wide brimmed hat on crooked.