On the "survivor movement": 'these are folks who have a profoundly unhealthy preoccupation with the alleged wrongs done against them"

[Julie Anne]

The personal stories I have read have left me in tears. People who say “get over it and move along” really don’t have a clue. It’s interesting how callous people can be (and I’ve seen evidence of that here). Some people give more credibility to rape and physical abuse, yet when we are talking about someone’s eternal soul, they say to move along and get over it. The reality is that if we do not handle these precious souls carefully, many times they become atheists and those are the ones who speak loudly against Christ. I had an enormous amount of e-mail and comments from people after the media attention telling me that they became atheists after a horrible church experience. If the Bible is clear about false teachers and wolves and battered sheep, we need to take a good look and see if we are giving that issue the attention it deserves. God is not abandoning His hurting sheep, but many Christians are by their negative responses. That is not love, nor compassion.

Julie Anne, thank you for sharing. Admittedly, I don’t know anything about you, your situation, or your blog. The observations I’ve made above about survivor blogs are based on my own 12-year experience on one and the observations I’ve made while reading others.

That being said, a few of your comments trouble me because they are (or at least appear to be) questioning the efficacy of the gospel. I hope you do not view me as harsh or callous for making the following observations:

1) According to Scripture, genuine believers will not “become atheists” when faced with hurt feelings, mistreatment, or abusive relationships. Consequently, to frame your passion on this issue as primarily trying to keep hurting Christians from leaving the faith is troubling. Can wounded believers for a time become disillusioned, resentful, untrusting, and even unforgiving? Certainly, but that is why it is so important that there is someone helping them work through the implications of the gospel in their situations.

2) People who you feel are saying “get over it and move along” may actually have a clue. They may actually have seen the personal destruction that self-pity, pride, resentment, or unforgiveness cause when they allowed their emotions and feelings to control them instead of the truth of God’s Word.

3) We should all strive to handle these situations biblically. This may mean in some situations that we weep with those that weep. This may mean in other situations that we rebuke and admonish individuals who are feeding off of their past hurts and who want to live in the past.

4) As you provide the spiritual care that you do to these individuals, are you working alongside your own church and under the guidance of your pastors / elders?

1. Wow - you’re right. I acknowledge “become” atheists was worded very poorly. I previously had an issue with editing on this forum and hoped that my message was going to be clear enough. When I reread it now, it is not clear and thank you for mentioning it. The main point I’m trying to say is that spiritual abuse is a stumbling block to people’s faith. We need to help them get out of that dark valley and see the truth. One thing about the “atheists” e-mails, is I sensed that they weren’t settled in that title, either, but were almost crying out, so that’s why I wasn’t convinced that they were true atheists, but in a desperate state. I should have been more clear.

2. The problem with the “get over it” issue is that what I’m seeing here and so many other places is a quick negative judgment without really gathering much information. Judging based on speculation or first reaction is wrong. Again - how is it showing Biblical love when assuming the worse in someone?

3. Agree completely, but also want to caution putting the healing process in a box - who is the one who gets to determine “how long is too long”?

4. I am in a new church and my pastor is aware of the blog/lawsuit. I have mentioned the desire to have assistance, but have not had a response as of yet. There are people behind the scenes, pastors, Biblical counselors, spiritual abuse “experts” who are helping, as needed. A number of these people also contribute to the blog (articles/comments) and there seems to be quite a few people who have “graduated” from their spiritual abuse experience and hang around to be of assistance. Ideally, I would like to have more oversight. The blog’s intent has changed from its original intent after the media involvement. It’s still quite new.

[Wayne Wilson]

Tom, I don’t disagree with those points. I was thrown by the idea of moral equivalence. I believe the oppressive shepherd’s sin is greater in God’s eyes than the oppressed person’s weakened faith or anger.

Wayne, in cases of abusive pastors and spiritual authority, we can take heart knowing that God promises to hold those in spiritual authority to greater account (James 3:1). Additionally, God will hold accountable those who cause others to stumble in their faith (Matt 18). But, this may NEVER occur during the person’s lifetime. Many of the people I’ve encountered on survivor blogs want immediate retribution for the mistreatment they believe they have received. They want justice, and they see what they are doing as a way to exact revenge on those responsible for their hurt. Again, this is where the gospel must be brought to bear and where the moderator(s) should step in to help those individuals work through not only their pain / anger but also the appropriate gospel response.

As I said before, in my experience this rarely happened. I am thankful that you have experienced something different.

In response, Julie wrote:

1. Wow - you’re right. I acknowledge “become” atheists was worded very poorly. I previously had an issue with editing on this forum and hoped that my message was going to be clear enough. When I reread it now, it is not clear and thank you for mentioning it. The main point I’m trying to say is that spiritual abuse is a stumbling block to people’s faith. We need to help them get out of that dark valley and see the truth. One thing about the “atheists” e-mails, is I sensed that they weren’t settled in that title, either, but were almost crying out, so that’s why I wasn’t convinced that they were true atheists, but in a desperate state. I should have been more clear.

I found your statement very clear—pastors who abuse their people create victims who no longer functionally believe in God. By that I mean that they simply do not trust Him anymore. Sure, they’re saved by the blood of Christ, I believe—but their day-to-day experience of Christ has been horrible damaged, often-times beyond repair in this life. They don’t need to get over it, find a better church, read their Bible more (esp. if they come from an allegedly Bible-based abusive church. Of course, the philosophical position of atheism was not the topic, nor was the idea that a person who once has believed in God can then “stop” doing so. You were, I believe, writing about people who have been victimized and who are simply living in some sort of survivor-mode that victims often adopt.

You also wrote:

2. The problem with the “get over it” issue is that what I’m seeing here and so many other places is a quick negative judgment without really gathering much information. Judging based on speculation or first reaction is wrong. Again - how is it showing Biblical love when assuming the worse in someone?

Thanks for writing, Julie. Having survived a horribly abusive, autocratic church (as you know), and how having been a pastor for almost 10 years, I am glad that you are reaching people who need to process this issue (which involves much, much more than Bible studies and getting the gospel right, for goodness sake!), and who genuinely need some means of healthy re-entry to Christian community, and hopefully, the church itself. Our churches are chock full of members who have been taken advantage of, controlled, put down, and silenced in the very community in which they should have found a whole new experience of freedom, forgiveness, and grace. Frankly, I’m scratching my head at the idea that some Christians would even speculate as to whether the problem really is as bad as it is… considering 1 Tim, 2 Tim 3, 2 Pet, Jude, etc., not to mention Revelation!

In an abusive church there are lies that are told. My adult son came away with the thought that there is nothing he can do to measure up, so why bother. He was left in a state of spiritual confusion and complacency and didn’t care because he knew he sinned and was on his way to hell anyway, so why bother?

…sinned and was on his way to hell anyway.

This is actually a doctrinal problem. It’s interesting to me how often problems of practice are really doctrinal problems working themselves out. Since the gospel teaches that those who are in Christ are a new creation and that Christ has become sin for them and they have the righteous of God in Him, the gospel cures this particular part of the “spiritual abuse” problem.

I wonder how much of the rest of the problem would be solved by sound doctrine as well.

[Ken Garrett]

Having survived a horribly abusive, autocratic church (as you know), and how having been a pastor for almost 10 years, I am glad that you are reaching people who need to process this issue (which involves much, much more than Bible studies and getting the gospel right, for goodness sake!), and who genuinely need some means of healthy re-entry to Christian community, and hopefully, the church itself. Our churches are chock full of members who have been taken advantage of, controlled, put down, and silenced in the very community in which they should have found a whole new experience of freedom, forgiveness, and grace…

The problem, Ken, is that without a proper understanding of the gospel these people will neither find nor experience true freedom, forgiveness, and grace. Consequently, when you set up a therapeutic model to deal with spiritual abuse, and it involves neither the gospel nor its implications in the life of the offended, the person cannot be truly spiritually helped and healed. So, you’re right that it involves more, but it certainly doesn’t involve less. Again, in my experience, the gospel and its implications are what are missing from these survivor blogs.

Hi T Howard,

Just for clarification, have you personally counseled people who have escaped bible-based, spiritually abusive churches, and are you a pastor or elder in a church presently? I just wondered if you’re in the thick of the battle, or merely sharing your insights into it. Perhaps the problem with “these survivor blogs” is that estranged, hurting, often doctrinally-sound Christians have found themselves marginalized and victimized by bad leaders, and have nowhere else to take their pain and fears of church, and therefore end up in “safe,” annonymous online communities. Although doctrinal abberancy and error is one mark of a false teacher, you’ll find in Scripture, from Korah to Jude and all in between, that it is the ethical/moral behavior of bad leaders that is most indicative of their true nature before God. Many of the abusive churches you’ll find have doctrinal statements that are perfectly evangelical, and almost word-for-word the same as some of the best churches and seminaires around, such as Dallas Theological, Master’s, Western, Westminster, etc. So, while I appreciate your hypothesis that the flaw in abusive systems (and in their survivors) is a failure in doctrine, I believe such an explanation is merely one of many, varied, components to the problem. Thanks for reading! Ken

T Howard said: Consequently, when you set up a therapeutic model to deal with spiritual abuse, and it involves neither the gospel nor its implications in the life of the offended, the person cannot be truly spiritually helped and healed. So, you’re right that it involves more, but it certainly doesn’t involve less. Again, in my experience, the gospel and its implications are what are missing from these survivor blogs.

How do you propose reaching them with the gospel when they are angry at pastors, churches, the Bible, and God? They have hearts of stone at this point and don’t have ears to hear.

Every lost person is at emnity with God, regardless of the reason they might give for their anger.

[Ken Garrett]

Hi T Howard,

Just for clarification, have you personally counseled people who have escaped bible-based, spiritually abusive churches, and are you a pastor or elder in a church presently? I just wondered if you’re in the thick of the battle, or merely sharing your insights into it.

Ken, I currently serve as a deacon for member care at my church, my wife and I have taught and discipled college students for the past 8 years, and if it matters, I was molested by a pastor’s son when I was a kid. In working with college students, my wife and I deal with a whole host of personal and interpersonal issues and provide biblical counseling to students when approached. While I have not experienced “spiritual abuse,” I have spent 4 years in an environment that others have claimed was spiritually abusive and hurtful.

Perhaps the problem with “these survivor blogs” is that estranged, hurting, often doctrinally-sound Christians have found themselves marginalized and victimized by bad leaders, and have nowhere else to take their pain and fears of church, and therefore end up in “safe,” annonymous online communities. Although doctrinal abberancy and error is one mark of a false teacher, you’ll find in Scripture, from Korah to Jude and all in between, that it is the ethical/moral behavior of bad leaders that is most indicative of their true nature before God. Many of the abusive churches you’ll find have doctrinal statements that are perfectly evangelical, and almost word-for-word the same as some of the best churches and seminaires around, such as Dallas Theological, Master’s, Western, Westminster, etc. So, while I appreciate your hypothesis that the flaw in abusive systems (and in their survivors) is a failure in doctrine, I believe such an explanation is merely one of many, varied, components to the problem. Thanks for reading! Ken

Ken, I don’t remember saying that doctrinal statements determine whether a pastor or a church is spiritually abusive. In fact, I agree with you that Scripture places a strong emphasis on a man’s character and motives (1 Tim 3; Tit 1; 1 Pet 5) when determining whether he is qualified to be an elder. Consequently, a man who is self-willed, pugnacious, and a tyrant, but who adheres to the Westminster Confession, is still unqualified to be an elder. My point has been that the main flaw in the survivor blogs that I’ve experienced is that they provide people coping mechanisms and catharsis, but they rarely teach the love, truth, and hope of the gospel and how that applies to the offended and the offender. They are content to let people commiserate with one another, and this alone will not provide spiritual help and healing.

How do you propose reaching them with the gospel when they are angry at pastors, churches, the Bible, and God? They have hearts of stone at this point and don’t have ears to hear.

If I am counseling a believer who has been hurt and seems to have a heart of stone, I must pray that the Holy Spirit would give me sensitivity, wisdom, and discernment in dealing with this individual and would begin to work in this person’s life and soften his/her heart to be receptive once again to God’s Word. Only by the Holy Spirit’s working will someone receive and accept the love, truth, and hope of the gospel and its implications for his or her life and hurtful past. We must remember that in biblical terms, we’re dealing with the issue of sanctification.

I’m very sorry! I’ve obviously misread you, as you certainly have some experience with being abused and taken advantage of, etc. It sounds like you’ve got some wonderful opportunities to minister to the folks around you! I appreciate your comments.

Blessings, brother! Ken

Here are several diagnostic questions that need to be asked and answered (but rarely are in my experience) on survivor blogs:

1) Did the treatment you experienced in your past come from a genuinely spiritually abusive situation / environment or is it a result of personal sin (e.g. pride, self will, disobedience, etc.) or of being over-sensitive?

2) Are you content with living and re-living the past, or do you desire to move forward with your life?

3) What do you want to accomplish as a result of posting / participating in this blog?

4) Who do you have IRL to work through these issues with you and to keep you accountable (e.g. pastor, spouse, family member, church family, Christian counselor, etc.)?

5) Are you willing to obey God’s Word as it addresses your situation and the issues involved, even if doing so goes against your feelings and emotions?

Granted, some of these questions may come across as harsh or callous, but they need to be asked and answered at some point. Question 1 establishes the validity of the mistreatment. Question 2 establishes whether the person truly wants help. Question 3 establishes motivation for participation. Question 4 establishes what IRL support structures are in place or available to the individual: anonymous online blogs cannot provide the “one anothers” of Scripture that this person needs. Question 5 establishes whether the person is committed to the sanctification process.

T Howard said:

Granted, some of these questions may come across as harsh or callous, but they need to be asked and answered at some point. Question 1 establishes the validity of the mistreatment. Question 2 establishes whether the person truly wants help. Question 3 establishes motivation for participation. Question 4 establishes what IRL support structures are in place or available to the individual: anonymous online blogs cannot provide the “one anothers” of Scripture that this person needs. Question 5 establishes whether the person is committed to the sanctification process.

I concur with your very good questions and also appreciate that you included that the questions need to be asked “at some point”, seemingly acknowledging that you see it as a process, not something instantaneous. My question is: how are you finding these people? You seem to be in a unique situation working with people on a daily basis, so perhaps you are running into these folks - that’s great. A lot of these hurt individuals are not in a place where they would consider going back to church - they are raw. I do believe that somewhere along the process the issues you mention need to be addressed. They naturally came to my site because they have an instant connection with my story. You, as a deacon, may represent an abuse figure to them and they may not have ears to hear anything you have to say, sadly. In this respect, I consider my blog to be a stepping stone to get people over that hump so they can venture out and begin to trust people like you who seem to really care for their souls.