Prosposed FBFI Special Resolution on Abuse

[DavidO] So, just out of curiousity, what happens if a dissenting individual member who happens to be a pastor leads his flock in a direction inconsistent with a resolution. Take beverage alcohol. What if a pastor and his congregation modified thier constitution that once stated all use was prohibited to state that drunkeness was prohibited and dropped teetotalling as requirement for pastor/deacons?

From the FBFI Constitution, available on the website:

Discipline and Dismissal of Members: Members who persist in sin after the scriptural procedures found in Matthew 18:11-22 have been exercised by their local churches, or who by their persistent resistance to attempts to contact them make reconciliation impossible, or who are known to be out of fellowship with the Statement of Faith and purposes of the Fellowship, and will not alter their direction, shall be excluded by a majority action of the Board of Directors.

Lest people continue to think that IFB churches are woefully out of the loop and Neanderthal in their methods (After all we are accused of using music from the 1800’s and clothes from the 50’s and a Bible 400 years old) let me remind you of something.

What fundamentalist wrote a book dealing with sexual abuse?

Hints: It was written in the 1980’s. (About the time states legislated that licensed daycares had to do background checks on employees.)

It was written by an already established writer of several books.

It was written by a lady who revealed that she had been a victim in her youth.

Her last name was not Zicterman or Massi.

My apologies for not being computer savvy enough to have the them music for Jeopardy come in now. So I’ll hum….dum, dum, dum da da dumb dumb dumb, da da dumb da da dumb… You know how it goes.

If you guess please also give the name of the book and publisher.

[Ken Woodard] Lest people continue to think that IFB churches are woefully out of the loop and Neanderthal in their methods (After all we are accused of using music from the 1800’s and clothes from the 50’s and a Bible 400 years old) let me remind you of something.

What fundamentalist wrote a book dealing with sexual abuse?

I would guess you are referring to Beneth Jones’ book.

Regardless, what does that have to do with the fact that there is a problem in the way many, many Fundamentalists think about abuse? The fact is that we all know it’s a problem. And those who deny it are often only revealing that they have the same problems in their thinking.

[Don Johnson]

[JG] I’ll be very, very surprised if they don’t have a resolution dealing with this issue, but it won’t be that one.

The process, as I understand it, is that resolutions are proposed and passed at the board level first, then proposed to the membership at the annual meeting. I don’t think there is an attempt to give instant responses to current events, rather to work carefully on resolutions over a period of time.

I do agree, if there is an FBF resolution on this topic in the future, it won’t be this one.

This makes sense.

Personally, I’d rather that the FBFI didn’t do anything this year and had a really strong, legally correct, Biblically grounded statement (or two) next year that addresses all aspects rather than a half baked “we’re all guilty and should be blamed” resolution this year for the purpose of assuaging the vengeful.

[Jay C.] Personally, I’d rather that the FBFI didn’t do anything this year and had a really strong, legally correct, Biblically grounded statement (or two) next year that addresses all aspects rather than a half baked “we’re all guilty and should be blamed” resolution this year for the purpose of assuaging the vengeful.

I think you’ve characterised the supporters of this resolution unkindly to say the least. If your daughter were a victim, would you feel the same way?

Remember how long the Roman Catholic Church took to address problems after they became a major issue in the press? The abuse was one strike against the church. The failure to address it in a timely and decisive manner was the second strike.

If the FBFI doesn’t pass a resolution this year, it would at least be wise, in my view, to announce a plan for addressing it.

[Don Johnson]

[DavidO] So, just out of curiousity, what happens if a dissenting individual member who happens to be a pastor leads his flock in a direction inconsistent with a resolution. Take beverage alcohol. What if a pastor and his congregation modified thier constitution that once stated all use was prohibited to state that drunkeness was prohibited and dropped teetotalling as requirement for pastor/deacons?

From the FBFI Constitution, available on the website:

Discipline and Dismissal of Members: Members who persist in sin after the scriptural procedures found in Matthew 18:11-22 have been exercised by their local churches, or who by their persistent resistance to attempts to contact them make reconciliation impossible, or who are known to be out of fellowship with the Statement of Faith and purposes of the Fellowship, and will not alter their direction, shall be excluded by a majority action of the Board of Directors.

Has this ever happened?

Jason -

I’m not addressing the victims and those affected when I refer to the ‘vengeful’. I’m talking specifically about people who are using the Anderson case to attack fundamentalism as a whole with allegations of conspiring to commit and hide sexual abuse. In my mind, there’s two groups out there - people who are making hay in order to attack the whole “movement” (whatever that movement is) and people who were victimized. Some of the victims fall into that first group, and I am sorry they were abused, but they’re still responsible to handle things correctly, and several of them - not all - are choosing to remain bitter and angry about what happened; they are also using what happened to them as a legitimate means to take revenge on everyone in the “movement”. I think we all can and should support those who were victimized and still make sure that they handle their issues correctly via the law, counseling, and such.

As an aside, I originally supported this resolution (see my above posts). I do think the FBFI ought to address it formally in some way, although I doubt this will get done at the meetings this (next?) week.

Make more sense?

[Jason]

[Ken Woodard] Lest people continue to think that IFB churches are woefully out of the loop and Neanderthal in their methods (After all we are accused of using music from the 1800’s and clothes from the 50’s and a Bible 400 years old) let me remind you of something.

What fundamentalist wrote a book dealing with sexual abuse?

I would guess you are referring to Beneth Jones’ book.

Regardless, what does that have to do with the fact that there is a problem in the way many, many Fundamentalists think about abuse? The fact is that we all know it’s a problem. And those who deny it are often only revealing that they have the same problems in their thinking.

This has to do with the accusations that broad brush us all as being unconcerned and hinting at a network of perverts that are covering up rather than confronting this sin. It also has to do with the accusations that we don’t care about the victims. Beneth Jones, with the full support of BJIII and the BJU press stepped to the front decades ago about this issue. Now they get drug through the mud and painted as a training camp for perverted preachers. Give me a break!

Maybe this has already been said. I haven’t read through everything in detail.

This resolution is a farce. It mocks the FBFI who passed a very similar resolution about the abuse in Catholicism a few years ago. The point was to use their own language against them. My biggest concern is that the FBFI might actually PASS something similar. If they do, then (like all the other meaningless resolutions) they will think they’ve actually done something meaningful on the subject. And they’ll also lull their church members into complacency. Members will THINK their leaders are doing something and stop pressuring them to do the right thing.

If they don’t pass something similar, it will at least point out their hypocrisy.

@Ken - What’s the name of that book?

@Dan - I don’t think that they’re ‘trying to use the language against them’ insomuch as they’re using that resolution as a foundational point to craft a new one on this particular subject, which is what I believe the author claims they do. Let’s not look for dragons if there are geckos around, KWIM?

It is to late to throw together a resolution and a resolution wouldn’t do the subject justice. Waiting untill next years meeting is to far out. They would be better off making the topic of one of the issues of Frontline entirely about how to deal with the problem.They could have articles from the different angles, a victim, a pastor, law enforcement, maybe even an interview with a perpetrator.

[Jay C.] @Ken - What’s the name of that book?
?

Mount Up on Wounded Wings

Ok, another drive by post…..I am really under the gun with time this week. I am not a member of the FBF….I let my subscription lapse to Frontline a few years ago because of money and I haven’t renewed it since. But I did like it on facebook. I didn’t realize it was private. So Don, I am not a coward. :)

I do think these resolutions are sometiems silly. But if we are going to have them, we should have them about this. Most of these resolutions are nothing mroe than, “we believe in Jesus.” So, in my mind, I had no problem with the substance of it. So I supported it (still do). I am going to recomend we use it as the frame work for a similar resolution for a board that I am on.

JG,

I dont think any of us that responded positvely to a resolution are in the FBFI. Judging by my friends in the FBFI, I am not sure many of them really want a resolution. They all seem to be hiding behind being Independant. But if we apply “good ole boy” pressure on music, we certainly should do so so on this issue.

be adopted this year. I just got my issue of the latest Frontline. As is the SOP, it contains this years resolutions and an explanation. To the best of my knowledge, FBF resolutions come out of the Executive Board. They are not a matter of floor action.

[rogercarlson] Ok, another drive by post…..I am really under the gun with time this week. I am not a member of the FBF….I let my subscription lapse to Frontline a few years ago because of money and I haven’t renewed it since. But I did like it on facebook. I didn’t realize it was private. So Don, I am not a coward. :)

Roger, I think I specifically named the author of the ‘resolution’ as a coward. Those who are putting their names to it are not being cowardly, but I think they are very unwise, especially as you do not know who is behind the resolution and what their credibility to speak to this issue is.

So… here’s hoping you don’t ‘unfriend’ me!

[rogercarlson] Judging by my friends in the FBFI, I am not sure many of them really want a resolution. They all seem to be hiding behind being Independant. But if we apply “good ole boy” pressure on music, we certainly should do so so on this issue.

Brother, I think you don’t understand what resolutions are. They are meant to define us far more than to discipline them. The resolutions define our views as a collective group. We put our names to them. This is what we believe. For the record, I am on the Resolutions Committed and stand by our resolutions for this year.