When is it abuse?
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The discussion over the Elizabeth Vargas piece on Pastor Phelps and IFB churches has gotten me to wonder if there is anything substantive on the area of abuse, particularly in regards to age. We deal in a society with differing views on adults and minors, on people who are seventeen years eleven months and one month later when they turn eighteen. While I think the age of consent in lower in some states, there are examples of this viewpoint causing problems. For example, there are situations where 18 year olds are being prosecuted for sexual relations with 16 years olds.
My question is: is every sexual situation with someone who is under the age of consent (16-18 years) always abuse? Is there ever a time when someone under the legal age of consent is making a moral choice of his/her own? While this is a very sensative topic, I hope we might have an honest discussion over what abuse is and isn’t. Please, please don’t assume that by asking the question I am taking the side of any abuser. Sexual abuse or any abuse is horrific. I also acknowledge that abuse happens, probably more frequently that we’d like to think too. It’s a great thing if evangelical baptist and bible churches take a serious look at these issues, admit failures where they exist, and find solutions to future problems. If we can’t discuss this issue intelligently, without too much emotion getting the best of us, I rather doubt if we’ll be able to come to some solutions that really work. I’m willing to learn here and would be grateful for any responses people may have.
Matt
My question is: is every sexual situation with someone who is under the age of consent (16-18 years) always abuse? Is there ever a time when someone under the legal age of consent is making a moral choice of his/her own? While this is a very sensative topic, I hope we might have an honest discussion over what abuse is and isn’t. Please, please don’t assume that by asking the question I am taking the side of any abuser. Sexual abuse or any abuse is horrific. I also acknowledge that abuse happens, probably more frequently that we’d like to think too. It’s a great thing if evangelical baptist and bible churches take a serious look at these issues, admit failures where they exist, and find solutions to future problems. If we can’t discuss this issue intelligently, without too much emotion getting the best of us, I rather doubt if we’ll be able to come to some solutions that really work. I’m willing to learn here and would be grateful for any responses people may have.
Matt
I agree, Bro. Walker, that there is more to consider than just the legal aspect. Every state has different laws about the age of consent and the age difference between those involved in a sexual relationship. It’s bizarre that kids as young as 12 can engage in sexual conduct without consequences, but it becomes a crime when one party is just a bit too much older than the other?
It is clearly a criminal act to intimidate or force someone into sex. But- it is a fact that a young person may engage in consensual sex. The problem is that young people in our day and age aren’t very mature and don’t understand the repercussions of their actions. I think it is fair if an older person who takes advantage of this is prosecuted for statutory rape. I don’t care if a 16 yog tries to do a lap dance- no one is forced to succumb to temptation.
It is worth noting that there was a time when older men married young women in order to produce offspring. No one was blinking when a 60 yo Civil War general married a 15 yog back in the day. It was SOP. Now it’s a crime. What made us change our thinking on that?
Bottom line- As Christians, we are to flee fornication. I don’t see much fleeing going on, especially when the average Christian family enjoys watching simulated (and not so simulated) sexual activity on a regular basis via tv and movies, much of it involving teen actors/actresses, or older actors/actresses depicting teen characters. That, IMO, is seriously icky.
It is clearly a criminal act to intimidate or force someone into sex. But- it is a fact that a young person may engage in consensual sex. The problem is that young people in our day and age aren’t very mature and don’t understand the repercussions of their actions. I think it is fair if an older person who takes advantage of this is prosecuted for statutory rape. I don’t care if a 16 yog tries to do a lap dance- no one is forced to succumb to temptation.
It is worth noting that there was a time when older men married young women in order to produce offspring. No one was blinking when a 60 yo Civil War general married a 15 yog back in the day. It was SOP. Now it’s a crime. What made us change our thinking on that?
Bottom line- As Christians, we are to flee fornication. I don’t see much fleeing going on, especially when the average Christian family enjoys watching simulated (and not so simulated) sexual activity on a regular basis via tv and movies, much of it involving teen actors/actresses, or older actors/actresses depicting teen characters. That, IMO, is seriously icky.
Laws need to be as specific as possible to remove ambiguity. That’s why there are so many amended statutes. As attorneys find loopholes in the law, they are amended (we hope) to close them.
I think Susan is right where she states the bottom line is the Biblical principle of fleeing fornication. That is scriptural and has nothing to do with age.
On the worldly side there are so many questions that need to be answered. Is it rape if she told the man she was 18 and looked 18? Should the man ask for ID? What if the ID is fake are you still culpable? There is a different standard also when the woman is the older “abuser” to a younger boy. When a female NH Teacher was caught in an inappropriate relationship with a teen student this past year, most of the comments from people in the papers/blogs were “you lucky dog”, “should’ve kept your mouth shut”, “I want to be abused”.
In most states a man can marry a girl under 18, subject to I believe, parental permission. So if they are now married, he is 21 and she is 15…is it still a sexual assault? Under the law it may be.
Finally, don’t be decieved into thinking that groups are not working to lower the age of consent. I believe NAMBLA is active in this.
You kind of have to think that Christ’s return is soon.
I think Susan is right where she states the bottom line is the Biblical principle of fleeing fornication. That is scriptural and has nothing to do with age.
On the worldly side there are so many questions that need to be answered. Is it rape if she told the man she was 18 and looked 18? Should the man ask for ID? What if the ID is fake are you still culpable? There is a different standard also when the woman is the older “abuser” to a younger boy. When a female NH Teacher was caught in an inappropriate relationship with a teen student this past year, most of the comments from people in the papers/blogs were “you lucky dog”, “should’ve kept your mouth shut”, “I want to be abused”.
In most states a man can marry a girl under 18, subject to I believe, parental permission. So if they are now married, he is 21 and she is 15…is it still a sexual assault? Under the law it may be.
Finally, don’t be decieved into thinking that groups are not working to lower the age of consent. I believe NAMBLA is active in this.
You kind of have to think that Christ’s return is soon.
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