My name is Ron Wheeler. I Am Not Anonymous.

Frankly, Ron, I think you are on to something. I am increasingly convinced that every time a member leaves a church badly, there ought to be church discipline. No one should be allowed to just slink quietly into the night. It may not impact the departed, but it will still be a teaching moment for those who remain.

Why is it that my voice always seems to be loudest when I am saying the dumbest things?

[Chip Van Emmerik]

Frankly, Ron, I think you are on to something. I am increasingly convinced that every time a member leaves a church badly, there ought to be church discipline. No one should be allowed to just slink quietly into the night. It may not impact the departed, but it will still be a teaching moment for those who remain.

Sounds like a reign of terror

Really Jim? Why is that. When a member becomes disruptive in the body, scripture calls for discipline in the body. We are given three reasons for discipline in the body: purity, restoration, warning. A member who ducks out improperly has caused pain and disruption in the body, and discipline is the scriptural response with clear implication for two of the three reasons for discipline. Only God knows the potential for restoration in those situations, but it certainly doesn’t hinder restoration to follow God’s directives. Honestly, the church ought to vote, either in support or in discipline, on every departing member. After all, every member who joins is approved corporately, so why is leaving the body different (other than that’s not how we have been doing it). That’s why churches used to issue letters of recommendation to members who were moving to take to the next church they were going to join saying that they had left in good standing. This running from church to church just to stay out of trouble and being welcomed with open arms is wrong.

Why is it that my voice always seems to be loudest when I am saying the dumbest things?

[Chip Van Emmerik]

Really Jim? Why is that. When a member becomes disruptive in the body, scripture calls for discipline in the body. We are given three reasons for discipline in the body: purity, restoration, warning. A member who ducks out improperly has caused pain and disruption in the body, and discipline is the scriptural response with clear implication for two of the three reasons for discipline. Only God knows the potential for restoration in those situations, but it certainly doesn’t hinder restoration to follow God’s directives. Honestly, the church ought to vote, either in support or in discipline, on every departing member. After all, every member who joins is approved corporately, so why is leaving the body different (other than that’s not how we have been doing it). That’s why churches used to issue letters of recommendation to members who were moving to take to the next church they were going to join saying that they had left in good standing. This running from church to church just to stay out of trouble and being welcomed with open arms is wrong.

Chip, you make a good point, but if one leaves because of disagreement over doctrine (which can happen if the church doctrine has changed), there will never be corporate agreement or support, even if the leaving was handled as diplomatically and biblically as possible. Are you saying that all such departures should be handled as church discipline?

Dave Barnhart

Dave, I think Chip is saying that there ought to be church discipline if someone leaves due to a pattern of sin, not departures over a change in doctrine on either the part of the church or the member. But that said, I know I’ve personally voted to remove members when the members did not have Biblical faith. So even change in doctrine is not completely out of play.

And I’ll grant that all too often, church discipline can be a reign of terror—I knew of a church where for a while, it seemed that the measure of piety among the remaining members was how many people they could excommunicate, and for many, “church discipline” is a battering ram by which they get their way against the “problematic” members who disagree with them. So for Chip’s idea to work, you’ve got to remember that the primary goal of church discpline is not abuse, but restoration, of the believer.

Aspiring to be a stick in the mud.

It’s really very simple. If someone for one reason or another (good or bad) disappears into the wood work, a letter is not issued. In time, that person is removed from the rolls thorough erasure for nonattendance. This is a frequent situation at HSBC due to the transitory nature of our demographic.

Hoping to shed more light than heat..

When I read “Letters of Transfer” (above), I kept thinking of “letters of transit …

Tyler is a pastor in Olympia, WA and works in State government.

I thought we had the beginnings of a beautiful friendship. ;)

[TylerR] Casablanca

When I read “Letters of Transfer” (above), I kept thinking of “letters of transit …

Hoping to shed more light than heat..

[Rob Fall]

It’s really very simple. If someone for one reason or another (good or bad) disappears into the wood work, a letter is not issued. In time, that person is removed from the rolls thorough erasure for nonattendance. This is a frequent situation at HSBC due to the transitory nature of our demographic.

I minister in a very transitory area as well. In the Washington D.C. suburbs 3 years is a long time. While we’ve only been in existence for about seven years, I’m glad to say that we make every attempt not to have members disappear. We impress the responsibilities of membership on new members and, if someone is absent for any length of time, we seek them out. If members move, which they often do, we try to assist them in finding a good church and keep in contact until they do.

"Some things are of that nature as to make one's fancy chuckle, while his heart doth ache." John Bunyan

….but it strikes me as comforting that I’m not the only fan of old movies on this board. If only Hollyweird could make something like that again, I might actually go into a theater.

If they cleaned the stale gum off the seats, of course. :^)

Aspiring to be a stick in the mud.