How a Worship Format is Destroying the Evangelical Church

During my lifetime, many evangelical churches in American have moved from Bible-oriented gatherings to music-dominated meetings. Interestingly, both sets of religious gatherings typically bore the title, “Worship Service.”

When the evangelical church was Bible-oriented, this “worship” paradigm was in place:

(1) Not all elements of the service were considered equally important; the exposition of Scripture was clearly the first and foremost priority. All other competitors vied for a distant second place.

(2) When the term “worship” was used, it was the equivalent of our modern casual expression, “doing church.” It is important to note that the preaching of the Word was considered part of worship, as were announcements, testimonies, communion, prayer, singing, the offering, and special music. This was the typical structure of a “worship service” before 1980.

(3) Many evangelicals viewed music as a “warm up for the sermon.” In this regard, many leaders did not seem to often respect music ministry as actual ministry but many others did.

The change

But the paradigm has changed in many churches. The most important change was what the word “worship” communicates. The word “worship” is now used by clergy and laity alike to refer to the religious feelings aroused by music.

(1) The change in paradigms began with the addition on an article: “the” worship. As trivial as this seems, this was the beginning of emphasizing music and separating preaching and announcements from worship. We now have “the worship” and “the sermon.”

Here is just one possible scenario resulting from this change in definition. John Member has schedule a meeting with Pastor Jones. Let’s eavesdrop.

“Pastor, I think we need to cut down the time you preach. Fifteen minutes is plenty, I think.”

“I don’t agree,” replies Pastor Jones, “studying the Bible is crucial for every Christian.”

“Oh, I agree that the Bible is important, Pastor,” responds John Member, “but our morning service is billed as the morning worship service, so it should be mainly about worship, not preaching.”

In the above hypothetical conversation, you can see how the two meanings of the word “worship” are colliding with one another. In the pastor’s mind, Bible study is an important part of worship, but not in the mind of John Member. He views only music as “worship.”

(2) Other terminology changed. Schools that offered a major in church music (or “sacred music” for the hoi polloi) changed the major to “Worship Arts” (about the same time shades and curtains became “window treatments”). The song leader became known as the “worship leader.”

(3) Music became more emotionally intense, and a confusion between the emotional and the spiritual helped set music on an untouchable pedestal. Worship had become something one felt, not something one did. Worship was judged as good or bad based upon how it made worshippers feel. The Scriptures no longer defined good worship; the individual had become the discerner of truth based upon how he felt.

(4) In mega-churches, elitism and an attitude oriented toward musicians performing to the standards of other musicians (rather than aiming to bless the congregation) seems to be the norm. In some cases, musicians have become a special religious caste (like a priest, they lead the sacrifice of praise into the holy place).

(5) Even though Colossians 3:16 implies we should aim our hymns and songs both vertically and horizontally (we sing to one another and in our hearts to the Lord), the entire concept of worshiping God in the third person is gone, despite the fact that many Psalms speak of God as “He” rather than “You.”

(6) The goal of worship is creating a religious atmosphere and its attendant feelings. Often times worship leaders are weak in biblical and theological matters, but because more Christians value “worship” above theology, some of these leaders are carving out a pattern for church with little regard for biblical teaching about what the church is supposed to do when gathered.

(7) Here is the pattern: eventually worship (music and that religious feeling) is considered almost on a par with Scripture, then equal to Scripture, and eventually superior to it.* The Scriptures become subservient to the music and are used more as transitions between songs than holy word to be expounded. Biblical sermons have given way to self-help lectures or emotionally charged sermons with lots of illustrations—replacing the previous Psalm 1 mentality. The idea of worshiping God through deep Bible study and meditation in the Word is unknown; worship now means music and feelings.

The consequences & dangers of the new “worship format”

  1. Religion is back in vogue. We used to hear “I’m not religious, I just love the Lord,” or “Christianity is not a religion; it is a relationship.” Because of the new emphasis on religious feeling, it is fair to say that we have moved back into the domain of religion.
  2. Worship has become a religious experience dependent upon something else than the gathering of Christians to study the Word, pray, celebrate communion, and sing a few hymns. Based upon modern viewpoints, the early church must have done a poor job of worshipping God.
  3. If the church is about worship, and if worship is a religious feeling induced from a church gathering, then, if I get a stronger version of that feeling somewhere else, that is where I need to be. Rather than the Bible, a passionate feeling of worship becomes the canon by which I measure truth.

As a result, Christians not only move from evangelical church to evangelical church, but they also desert evangelicalism. Our heritage is based upon the centrality of Scripture; we are really novices at the religion game. But even if we competed well on a religious level, are we right to trash the primacy of Scripture? What about the convictions of the Reformation?

The problem is not contemporary music, seeking to have meaningful worship through songs of praise, etc. The problem is displacement. When we displace the knowledge of the Word and solid doctrine with music (whether we call music worship or not), we are no longer under the lordship of Christ. The Christian life includes public worship, but the highest form of worship is hearing and doing the Word of God. That is why the ultimate “worship book” in the Bible, the book of Psalms, begins with emphasizing constant meditation on the Word. The longest Psalm (119) makes the point even more emphatically. God seeks those who worship Him in Spirit and in truth. It is hard to worship God in truth if you don’t know the truth and if you do not make the truth a priority.

Ed Vasicek Bio

Ed Vasicek was raised as a Roman Catholic but, during high school, Cicero (IL) Bible Church reached out to him, and he received Jesus Christ as his Savior by faith alone. Ed earned his BA at Moody Bible Institute and served as pastor for many years at Highland Park Church, where he is now pastor emeritus. Ed and his wife, Marylu, have two adult children. Ed has published over 1,000 columns for the opinion page of the Kokomo Tribune, published articles in Pulpit Helps magazine, and posted many papers which are available at edvasicek.com. Ed has also published the The Midrash Key and The Amazing Doctrines of Paul As Midrash: The Jewish Roots and Old Testament Sources for Paul's Teachings.

Discussion

[G. N. Barkman] Although the thread has largely departed from the subject of Spiritual Gifts for the last several posts, I wanted to throw out something. It seems best to me to consider Spiritual Gifts to be Holy Spirit empowered, guided, and utilized natrual gifts rather than something brand new given by the Holy Spirit at the time of the new birth. Some teachers already evidenced and practiced natural abilities in teaching before they were saved. Salvation gave them a new purpose and spiritual empowerment for their teaching. After all, since God knows those who are his before they are born, why would we expect Him to give us the “gifts” (talents, abilities) He intends for us to use in His Kingdom as part of our genetic and environmental experiences, then “activate” these as spiritual gifts when we are regenerated?
What did the OP have to do with spiritual gifts? I think this topic needs a thread of its own.

"Some things are of that nature as to make one's fancy chuckle, while his heart doth ache." John Bunyan

Ron,

Reading through the thread would help you discover the relevancy of the examination of this element of the discussion as a whole. But even more importantly, the creator of the thread, Ed, has been involved in this aspect of the topic so it appears he considers it relevant as well so many you need to talk to Ed.

[G. N. Barkman] Although the thread has largely departed from the subject of Spiritual Gifts for the last several posts, I wanted to throw out something. It seems best to me to consider Spiritual Gifts to be Holy Spirit empowered, guided, and utilized natrual gifts rather than something brand new given by the Holy Spirit at the time of the new birth. Some teachers already evidenced and practiced natural abilities in teaching before they were saved. Salvation gave them a new purpose and spiritual empowerment for their teaching. After all, since God knows those who are his before they are born, why would we expect Him to give us the “gifts” (talents, abilities) He intends for us to use in His Kingdom as part of our genetic and environmental experiences, then “activate” these as spiritual gifts when we are regenerated?
I agree. I believe the Bible defines some spiritual gifts as the capability to use a natural ability (teaching, administration, serving, etc.) to build up the church, to the glory of God.

There are other spiritual gifts that are no longer for today that are more miraculous or revelatory in nature.

-------
Greg Long, Ed.D. (SBTS)

Pastor of Adult Ministries
Grace Church, Des Moines, IA

Adjunct Instructor
School of Divinity
Liberty University

[Alex Guggenheim]
[G. N. Barkman] Although the thread has largely departed from the subject of Spiritual Gifts for the last several posts, I wanted to throw out something. It seems best to me to consider Spiritual Gifts to be Holy Spirit empowered, guided, and utilized natrual gifts rather than something brand new given by the Holy Spirit at the time of the new birth. Some teachers already evidenced and practiced natural abilities in teaching before they were saved. Salvation gave them a new purpose and spiritual empowerment for their teaching. After all, since God knows those who are his before they are born, why would we expect Him to give us the “gifts” (talents, abilities) He intends for us to use in His Kingdom as part of our genetic and environmental experiences, then “activate” these as spiritual gifts when we are regenerated?
The problem with the proposition is not that is does not seem to make sense but that it fails prescriptive demands. The phenomenon of ton pneumatikon or spirituals, do have a specific protocol in Scripture with regard to their definition, context and exercise. These must be adhered to beyond the temptation to employ human reasoning.

1. If they were natural gifts then they were already present when a person is saved, thereby contradicting the teaching that it is the moment of salvation these unique spiritual gifts are given by the Spirit of God.
Can you point me to the Scripture that teaches that spiritual gifts are given at the moment of salvation?
[Alex Guggenheim] 2. Their fundamental definitions conflict with this proposition. Something cannot be the same but different. One is spiritual the other is natural.
The difference is that they are now Spirit-empowered and can now be used for a spiritual function: to build up the body of Christ.
[Alex Guggenheim] 3. There are only a few gifts that may have certain features that appear to manifest themselves to the human eye the same way human talents do. However, if what you propose is true then the miraculous gifts certainly are left without explanation. There is no natural talent for turning water into wine or receiving revelation from God to declare prophecies, to heal someone on command. In fact look at the healing gift(s). Paul certainly was no medical person, in fact Dr. Luke was but who had the gift to heal? The Apostles.

The gift of teaching is often misunderstood as something that is simply an elevated natural gift. It is not. There may be the incidental occasion where a human teacher is given the spiritual gift of teaching but his human talent is not what makes his gift valid or operate. One need never be taught teaching methods if they have a teaching gift in order to instruct others in the Word of God in a manner far superior to a person without a teaching gift. In fact, give me a person who does not have the spiritual gift of teaching but has post-graduate training and experience in teaching and has instructed in at a college level and then give me a believer with the gift of teaching who has never been formally trained as a teacher and with both men having equal understanding of a text, I guarantee you when the Word of God is taught, the man with the teaching gift will excel far beyond the other because it is God’s Spirit providing the dynamism which God designed to be present in those with the teaching gift and occurs when they teach the Word of God that no human ability can match. It is not because they naturally possess anything but due to the unseen spiritual phenomenon that occurs when he is teaching which does not reside in the least in any of his natural abilities.
This is a complete misunderstanding of the biblical teaching of spiritual gifts. If this were the case then whenever someone with this gift of teaching opened his mouth to teach, it would automatically be Spirit-empowered. Instead, Romans 12: says:
Rom 12:6-8

6 Having then gifts differing according to the grace that is given to us, let us use them: if prophecy, let us prophesy in proportion to our faith; 7 or ministry, let us use it in our ministering; he who teaches, in teaching; 8 he who exhorts, in exhortation; he who gives, with liberality; he who leads, with diligence; he who shows mercy, with cheerfulness.

NKJV
This clearly indicates that although we might have a spiritual gift, we must be careful to use it. If we have the gift of teaching, we must use that gift of teaching when we teach. In other words, someone with the gift of teaching can teach but not be using the gift of teaching. Why? Because he is not empowered by the Spirit and glorifying God. So, employing the grace gift of teaching is using the natural gift of teaching under the Spirit’s empowerment for the building up of the body to the glory of God.

The gift is already present; what is added at salvation is capability to use that ability with the Spirit’s empowerment to build up the body of Christ to the glory of God.

-------
Greg Long, Ed.D. (SBTS)

Pastor of Adult Ministries
Grace Church, Des Moines, IA

Adjunct Instructor
School of Divinity
Liberty University

Greg Long wrote: Can you point me to the Scripture that teaches that spiritual gifts are given at the moment of salvation?
Far be it from me to put words in Alex’s mouth. However, I think 1 Corinthians 12:7ff indicate the spiritual gifts are a manifestation of the Spirit. If this is true, there can be no presence of the gifts apart from the Spirit. On aside note, I have often wondered if all of our gifts are given at once at salvation, or if, perhaps, gifts are given along the way as needed to face the different opportunities God provides for us.

Why is it that my voice always seems to be loudest when I am saying the dumbest things?

[Alex Guggenheim] 1. If they were natural gifts then they were already present when a person is saved, thereby contradicting the teaching that it is the moment of salvation these unique spiritual gifts are given by the Spirit of God.
[Greg Long] Can you point me to the Scripture that teaches that spiritual gifts are given at the moment of salvation?
Ephesians 4 and 1 Cor 12 identifies that the gifts given “us” are those appointed by God through his Spirit in the context of our spiritual state. That is, unless one is spiritual they do not receive any gift, these are spiritual gifts for those who are spiritual. The Spirit of God distributes them to “us”. Both statements are in the context of those who are children of God, those who are spiritually alive.
[Alex Guggenheim] 2. Their fundamental definitions conflict with this proposition. Something cannot be the same but different. One is spiritual the other is natural.
[Greg Long] The difference is that they are now Spirit-empowered and can now be used for a spiritual function: to build up the body of Christ.
This simply ignores their distinction and you have just repeated what was said earlier. That which is natural and that which is spiritual are not the same and taking something natural and heightening it is not making it spiritual. These are gifts that are spiritual in nature for our function within the body. Their very definition places them in separate categories. But more importantly the Bible distinguishes them as as cited before Eph 4 and 1 Corinthians 12 categorizes them as separate, they are called
ton pneumatikon
or “spirituals” not “naturals that are elevated”.
[Greg Long] This is a complete misunderstanding of the biblical teaching of spiritual gifts. If this were the case then whenever someone with this gift of teaching opened his mouth to teach, it would automatically be Spirit-empowered. Instead, Romans 12: says:
Rom 12:6-8

6 Having then gifts differing according to the grace that is given to us, let us use them: if prophecy, let us prophesy in proportion to our faith; 7 or ministry, let us use it in our ministering; he who teaches, in teaching; 8 he who exhorts, in exhortation; he who gives, with liberality; he who leads, with diligence; he who shows mercy, with cheerfulness.

NKJV
This clearly indicates that although we might have a spiritual gift, we must be careful to use it. If we have the gift of teaching, we must use that gift of teaching when we teach. In other words, someone with the gift of teaching can teach but not be using the gift of teaching. Why? Because he is not empowered by the Spirit and glorifying God. So, employing the grace gift of teaching is using the natural gift of teaching under the Spirit’s empowerment for the building up of the body to the glory of God.

The gift is already present; what is added at salvation is capability to use that ability with the Spirit’s empowerment to build up the body of Christ to the glory of God.
Well, again, you have simply ignored the problem that the miraculous gifts have no human corollary when you attempt to prescribe this “human talent” proposition.

Also, you seem to believe “Spirit-empowerment” does not come with the gifting. The Scriptures are clear, these are spiritual gifts and it is the Spirit of God that both gives them and is the source of their phenomenon. He is both the giver and empowerment. Ever believer has God’s Spirit and the power of God’s Spirit is what brings to reality the operation of the gifts. Every single time the spiritual gift one has is used, it operates because it is God’s Spirit that is at work, not human talent.

The imploring of Romans is for us to “use” the gifts and nothing about our ability to tweek the or control the Spirit’s work when we engage in this use. A passage to help you understand what is meant about the directive to use our gifts is in 1 Timothy 4:14 “Do not neglect your gift, which was given you through a prophetic message when the body of elders laid their hands on you”. What is being taught and directed on both occasions is the command simply to use and not ignore or neglect their use, not that when they are used we somehow can control work of the Spirit in the operation of the gift.

When a believer who has a spiritual gift exercises that gift, it operates on the basis of the Holy Spirit whose dynamism acts phenomenally in the interest of God the Father. Is the “filling of the Spirit” related to the function of the gifts? Only in that a believer either is or is not in fellowship with God when they are exercising that gift but whether they are or are not, the Spirit still maintains his function when such gifts are exercised.

A good definition with the distinction maintained is given by http://www.biblebb.com/files/mac/sg1850.htm John MacArthur :
A spiritual gift is a God-given capacity through which the Holy Spirit supernaturally ministers to the body. For example, I have the spiritual gift of teaching (or preaching). I minister to you as the Spirit of God energizes me. This is something that I can’t do humanly, but something the Spirit of God must do through me. Your spiritual gift is not cooking — there are good cooks who don’t even know God. It is a human ability. Your gift is not being a violin virtuoso. It is a terrific ability, but not a spiritual gift energized by the Holy Spirit. Your spiritual gift is a unique capacity to minister to the body of Christ through the channel of the Spirit of God, who supernaturally touches the lives of other people.

[Chip Van Emmerik] On aside note, I have often wondered if all of our gifts are given at once at salvation, or if, perhaps, gifts are given along the way as needed to face the different opportunities God provides for us.
Hi Chip,

One passage that has helped me with this question is 1 Peter 4:10: “As each one has received a gift, minister it to one another…”

Since Paul is writing to all levels of Christians, including those even born again a few days earlier (1 Pet. 1:3), his words are inclusive of all Christians. It seems to me that Peter believes each one receives one’s gift at the new birth. Otherwise, how could he write, “as each one has received a gift…”?

There is also a fullness implied. The gift each one has is to be faithfully ministered to one another. In other words, there doesn’t appear to be any idea of waiting for more gifting. Of course, the same can not be said of maturing in the use of the gift.

Thanks Ted. I have generally been inclined to accept the gifts being given at the moment of salvation. However, I don’t think the passages you cite emphatically preclude the possibility of gifts being given along the way in preparation for coming opportunities. The language would still seem to fit. Just a simple mental exercise without much consequence either way, but interesting to consider.

Why is it that my voice always seems to be loudest when I am saying the dumbest things?

[Chip Van Emmerik]
Greg Long wrote: Can you point me to the Scripture that teaches that spiritual gifts are given at the moment of salvation?
Far be it from me to put words in Alex’s mouth. However, I think 1 Corinthians 12:7ff indicate the spiritual gifts are a manifestation of the Spirit. If this is true, there can be no presence of the gifts apart from the Spirit. On aside note, I have often wondered if all of our gifts are given at once at salvation, or if, perhaps, gifts are given along the way as needed to face the different opportunities God provides for us.
Chip, the Bible clearly says:

  1. Grace gifts are given by God the Father (Rom. 12:3), God the Son (Eph. 4:11), and God the Spirit (1 Cor. 12:7-11).
  2. Grace gifts are empowered by God the Father (1 Cor. 12:4) and God the Spirit (1 Cor. 12:7-11).
  3. The Holy Spirit is given to Christians at salvation (1 Cor. 12:13).
    However, you are making an ASSUMPTION that grace gifts are also given at salvation based on your understanding of what grace gifts are. The problem is, the Bible DESCRIBES grace gifts, but never clearly DEFINES them. Many people believe they are special abilities given at the moment of salvation. That could be, but the Bible never clearly states that. Some of the miraculous gifts seem to fall into that category.

    But other gifts seem to be better defined as the capability to use an ability under the empowerment of the Spirit (1 Cor. 12), to build up the body of Christ (Eph. 4:11-16), to the glory of God the Father (1 Pet. 4:10-11). As I explained above, that’s why Paul can say that when you teach, be sure to use your spiritual gift of teaching (Rom. 12:3-8). If the gift were merely the ability, that wouldn’t make sense because every time you would teach you would be using your spiritual gift of teaching. But instead, every time I teach I should be sure to do it with the Spirit’s empowerment, for the building up of the body of Christ, to the glory of God. This is emphasized in 1 Pet. 4:10-11.

    What’s amazing is the variety of ways the Bible describes these “gifts”. They are pneumatikon—“spiritual things” (1 Cor. 12:1), charismaton—“grace gifts” (1 Cor. 12:4), diakonon—“ministries” or “services” (1 Cor. 12:5), energematon—“activities” or “workings” (1 Cor. 12:6), “the manifestation of the Spirit” (1 Cor. 12:7). Again, these gifts are described but not defined.

    Do you really think that if someone has the spiritual gift of teaching, they had no teaching ability before they were saved but at the moment of salvation now all of a sudden have this new ability to teach? I suppose that’s possible, but I think experience and my understanding of the biblical passages would lead me to believe that at the moment of salvation, now that they have the Holy Spirit, they have a new CAPABILITY to use that ability (how many times can I say it?) with the Spirit’s empowerment, for the edification of the body of Christ, to the glory of God.

-------
Greg Long, Ed.D. (SBTS)

Pastor of Adult Ministries
Grace Church, Des Moines, IA

Adjunct Instructor
School of Divinity
Liberty University

[Greg Long] Do you really think that if someone has the spiritual gift of teaching, they had no teaching ability before they were saved but at the moment of salvation now all of a sudden have this new ability to teach? I suppose that’s possible, but I think experience and my understanding of the biblical passages would lead me to believe that at the moment of salvation, now that they have the Holy Spirit, they have a new CAPABILITY to use that ability (how many times can I say it?) with the Spirit’s empowerment, for the edification of the body of Christ, to the glory of God.
Hi Greg,

I do agree with you in the general. I doubt that upon the new birth, someone with a stammering lisp and an inability to string two thoughts together is all of a sudden a teacher. Point well made, brother.

There does seem to be at least several instances of such a sharp distinction you might consider. For example, the gift of apostleship (1Cor. 12:28). How could anyone be naturally prepared for that? And its wonderful for all of us to remember that Jesus chose 12 men to be His apostles, but all had vastly different personality package as well. Jesus does seem to delight in taking the nobodies of this world and using them to humiliate the somebodies (Acts 4:13)! Sweet thought.

We also see this in 1st Century revelatory gifts. How might someone be naturally prepared for some of those? Say tongues? Or healings? Applying that to our present day, the Lord might save some great athlete, or CEO personality, but give them a serving gift that best edifies the body in a behind the scenes function. The same could be said for the gift of giving. I imagine a lot of believers with this gift were stingy and hoarders before the grace of salvation set them free from their sin.

But let me reiterate, in general, I do agree with you - especially regarding teaching type gifts.

[Chip Van Emmerik] Thanks Ted. I have generally been inclined to accept the gifts being given at the moment of salvation. However, I don’t think the passages you cite emphatically preclude the possibility of gifts being given along the way in preparation for coming opportunities. The language would still seem to fit. Just a simple mental exercise without much consequence either way, but interesting to consider.
It might be profitable to do a little digging on the aorist “recieved” in 1 Peter 4:10. I personally view it as “constative” aorist (the majority of aorists) - that is, it contemplates the action in its entirety.

Thanks Ted. I’ll tuck that away to look into further.

Why is it that my voice always seems to be loudest when I am saying the dumbest things?

[Greg Long] Do you really think that if someone has the spiritual gift of teaching, they had no teaching ability before they were saved but at the moment of salvation now all of a sudden have this new ability to teach? I suppose that’s possible, but I think experience and my understanding of the biblical passages would lead me to believe that at the moment of salvation, now that they have the Holy Spirit, they have a new CAPABILITY to use that ability (how many times can I say it?) with the Spirit’s empowerment, for the edification of the body of Christ, to the glory of God.
Let me clarify. I have always considered it important to train and exercise our gifts. I am a better teacher today than I was 15 years ago. It is not because I am more gifted, but because, among other things, my gifts are better exercised and trained; they are more useful. I think two things are important here. First, we are talking about certain abilities that are unique to the believer, because they are derived from God and exercised by His power alone. Therefore, I do not think we can equate them to similar abilities in the unsaved. The second is that the purpose of these gifts is specifically for the building of the church. An unsaved master teacher teaching history in a secular school or providing training for employees in a large company is not going to be adequately prepared to step into an adult Sunday school class and teach the Word. The most recognizable part of teaching is the presentation of some truth in an understandable fashion. However, an oft overlooked prerequisite is the ability to understand the material being taught. This would be part of the application of the gift of teaching - the Divine enablement not just to explain biblical truth but to understand it in the first place. I don’t think our consideration of spiritual gifts can be removed from the realm of the church.

Why is it that my voice always seems to be loudest when I am saying the dumbest things?

[Chip Van Emmerik]
[Greg Long] Do you really think that if someone has the spiritual gift of teaching, they had no teaching ability before they were saved but at the moment of salvation now all of a sudden have this new ability to teach? I suppose that’s possible, but I think experience and my understanding of the biblical passages would lead me to believe that at the moment of salvation, now that they have the Holy Spirit, they have a new CAPABILITY to use that ability (how many times can I say it?) with the Spirit’s empowerment, for the edification of the body of Christ, to the glory of God.
Let me clarify. I have always considered it important to train and exercise our gifts. I am a better teacher today than I was 15 years ago. It is not because I am more gifted, but because, among other things, my gifts are better exercised and trained; they are more useful. I think two things are important here. First, we are talking about certain abilities that are unique to the believer, because they are derived from God and exercised by His power alone. Therefore, I do not think we can equate them to similar abilities in the unsaved. The second is that the purpose of these gifts is specifically for the building of the church. An unsaved master teacher teaching history in a secular school or providing training for employees in a large company is not going to be adequately prepared to step into an adult Sunday school class and teach the Word. The most recognizable part of teaching is the presentation of some truth in an understandable fashion. However, an oft overlooked prerequisite is the ability to understand the material being taught. This would be part of the application of the gift of teaching - the Divine enablement not just to explain biblical truth but to understand it in the first place. I don’t think our consideration of spiritual gifts can be removed from the realm of the church.
To answer the first quote by Greg, it is correct, before someone is saved they do not have the capacity to exercise the spiritual gift of teaching because it does not exist in them. They can do all the human teaching they want but it is not the spiritual gift to teach.

There is something you seem to be ignoring and avoiding in your formula of human abilities being the source of our spiritual gifts. While in your rational process teaching might have some logical connection, tell me again about the miraculous gifts which were given and their correlation to human gifts? For someone to heal did they have to be a doctor or practical nurse? For someone to speak in tongues with no prior training, what exact human skill did they possess that was suddenly just heightened, were they all linguists? And receiving and communicating revelatory truth, what again was the human ability that was heightened? Simply because these other gifts are a bit less spectacular does not lessen the categorization as spiritual and not human talents. You ignore quite a bit and call upon a great deal of speculation and rational construction to make the point you are making, material that is no where present in Scripture.

And yes, the moment someone is saved who has never taught in human realms, if they have been given the spiritual gift of teaching then they have the spiritual gift of teaching. Think about what was just said above and think about the book of Acts where all these people began exercising the sign gifts immediately. Under your principle we cannot accept this happened. Why? Because they were just saved! How dare we believe that such immature believers have spiritual gifts to exercise so much so that they speak in tongues and others get saved or interpret or receive prophecies!

So the one with the teaching gift at salvation, in their immaturity they do not have much to teach since they do not have much doctrine learned. But the doctrine they do know, what minuscule amount that is, when they teach it, the gift of teaching is operative automatically. When evaluating those with the teaching gift distinguishes between novices in the Word and those who have gained mastery. It does not teach that because one is a novice they cannot or do not have the teaching gift. The novice is due to their unfamiliarity with doctrine, not their gifting to teaching.

Chip, I have a question on your statement with which I agree. You said that part of the spiritual enabling of the teaching gift would not only be communicating the material but understanding it. Do you believe there is a classification of the understanding that one with the teaching gift has the differs from the enlightenment a student receives. In other words, should we have the view that there is an implied spiritual enlargement and/or spiritual acceleration of the teacher’s capacity to learn and understand doctrine distinct from his students?

Alex, I’m not sure. I haven’t considered it from that angle. It is possible that this would truly be a part of the gift of teaching. Even if their understanding is the same, the gift of teaching would differentiate the teacher from the student in the ability to present the material. Along this vein, since both student and teacher are saved, and illumination is a work of the spirit common to all believers, perhaps the ability to communicate is the distinctive of spiritual gift. If so, the difference between the unsaved teacher and the saved teacher would be the ability to understand, while the difference between the saved teacher and the saved student would be the ability to understand. This is greatly simplified and probably skims over other necessary ingredients to the process. But it provides a clear contrast in my thinking between the two (three?) groups.

Why is it that my voice always seems to be loudest when I am saying the dumbest things?